Is strict rule following really a thing with Asperger's?

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hypercane3
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25 Jun 2023, 9:26 pm

I have heard this a lot, but haven't really observed it much in others. I have even seen it described as a virtue when it is anything but. I feel like I don't relate to this symptom at all. And yes, I call it a symptom because rules are often made by organizations that don't have aspies in mind at all at best or at worst are constructs from corporations that only care about their bottom line. I am not a strict rule follower. Rules are a social construct.

Very often, rules can be broken without causing any disruption whatsoever. I have a medical marijuana card and due to housing prices essentially doubling in my region in a year, I really didn't have choice but to sign for the only place I can afford. Can't really move if the prices increase that fast. I have used this treatment since 2019. They say I cannot use marijuana despite it being medical. They cite federal law and all that. Im not surprised. The interests of insurance companies and the like are more important than me as a paying tenant. I smoke outside where it won't disturb my roommates but it is still against the rules. I cannot even go swimming after dusk. I am going into my second year here and have broken both of these rules on a regular basis. How? I do it in a way that isn't disruptive. I smoke somewhere discretely and swim when the security guard leaves to patrol another apartment.

Liability and culture amongst other things has led to corporations creating lots of rules. The fact is that a substantial percentage of people cant afford to live in places where their lives aren't controlled by external humans and inaccurate assumptions (isn't that the aspie dream?). We are going into a time when few people can afford their own property and I fear that those on the spectrum will be the most impacted.

I'm fairly sensory hyposensitive. Maybe the sensory hypersensitive have a different view? I don't care if I hear a pool party by my window at 2am. Id hear it every single night if it meant that I could take a dip when I wanted to at 2am. The noise literally does not phase me in the slightest. If I walk by cigarettes (which I don't smoke), I am so used to it that I don't even notice it.

My current apartment told us (without it being mentioned in the lease) to keep our AC in auto rather than on. It is bad for the system. Roommate wants to obey some maintenance dude, as that is "what the office wants". I really couldn't care less what the office wants, they are mandated by the lease to fix our AC when it breaks and if I want the fan on then I want the fan on. Utility bill isn't high. If it breaks then I will just tell the maintenance team it was on auto the entire time and unexpectedly failed at 72F (that is another stereotype...we apparently cannot tell lies).

I've always had a clash with authority figures and I feel like my Asperger's positively contributes to that instead of negatively and merely being the exception. The idea that people with Asperger's blindly follow rules is some of the strangest BS I have ever heard. It doesn't make sense.



MatchboxVagabond
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25 Jun 2023, 9:38 pm

Often times there are also those with pathological demand avoidance as well. The tendency to follow rules blindly has a lot to do with the typical black and white thinking combined with limited ability to accurately judge the thoughts and motives of others.

But, it is going to depend a lot on the individual and how their brain developed.



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25 Jun 2023, 9:41 pm

My boss has described me as "doing things by the book". But even then, I don't always adhere to rules 100%. More than others, though.


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bobert
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25 Jun 2023, 10:40 pm

I generally like to follow rules if they seem logical, or necessary, but tend to disregard rules if they seem arbitrary, or make no sense.
I think one reason aspies are rule oriented is that rules provide stability in a seemingly chaotic world that can be hard for many of us to understand.



hypercane3
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26 Jun 2023, 12:05 am

bobert wrote:
I generally like to follow rules if they seem logical, or necessary, but tend to disregard rules if they seem arbitrary, or make no sense.
I think one reason aspies are rule oriented is that rules provide stability in a seemingly chaotic world that can be hard for many of us to understand.


A lot of rules make sense at the time to someone but don't make much sense in hindsight. Or we look back and see that it wasn't worth it. We are still paying the price three years later from trying to control a virus by restricting activity that is essential to our modern industrial/agricultural society (with separation of labor) while pouring cash into the system. Reduced economic growth+increased cash = massive inflation. The poor are still paying the price today. The rich got richer and the poor poorer. Inflation is through the roof and prices are still rising. 88 cent dollar sodas at WalMart will now cost around a dollar and 50 cents. Rent? Average in my area pre-COVID was in the 800s for a studio. Now it is like 2grand. Families are struggling. So many people think that whatever rule they support makes sense, but it often does not because nothing happens in isolation. Fauci may be an expert on viruses but he was not an expert on how pandemic control measures severely disrupt the system that modern humanity requires to subsist. Nor is he an expert on how people with adaptive issues (like Asperger's) may significantly struggle if they suddenly lose their means of support and subsistence due to regulation. Therefore, he wasn't entirely qualified to recommend restrictions. Many countries finally realized it was a losing proposition. For example, "zero COVID" in particular ended up not being a viable strategy because it doesn't build any tolerance or immunity within the population. Fauci's "spread the curve" ended up being seen as stupid when it was realized that people can get the virus over and over even when vaccinated with all the up to date boosters.



Last edited by hypercane3 on 26 Jun 2023, 12:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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26 Jun 2023, 12:09 am

colliegrace wrote:
My boss has described me as "doing things by the book". But even then, I don't always adhere to rules 100%. More than others, though.
My former boss had me write "The Book" after he realized that I knew all the short-cuts to getting things done.


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26 Jun 2023, 1:15 am

i feel like i will follow the rules if the rules make sense and dont harm anyone.



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26 Jun 2023, 1:36 am

There was a thread here saying about Aspies don't follow rules while the NTs are the rule-followers.

I hate rules. I hate being told what to do. Or my lack of attention issues can make me inadvertently break rules like health and safety rules, so whenever we get an inspector come to work I have to consciously make sure I'm doing everything safely.
Despite that, I'm not accident prone nor fearless of danger. Quite the opposite actually to both. So that just proves how ridiculous some health and safety rules are.


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26 Jun 2023, 1:48 am

I dunno really. It depends if there's money involved.


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26 Jun 2023, 3:16 am

I like my own rules that I make for myself. I don't like rules that are imposed on me. The main thing that makes me follow rules is to avoid the social interaction that often happens when you break the rules. If I think I can get away with something then I'll probably do it.

At one of the schools I went to there was a door that was a shortcut. Students weren't allowed to use this door but teachers were. I couldn't stand that door rule and I went through it religiously because of that. In a world of stupid arbitrary rules that was the one that really made me angry. I can still feel a bit of anger writing about it now.


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hypercane3
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26 Jun 2023, 7:06 pm

DuckHairback wrote:
I like my own rules that I make for myself. I don't like rules that are imposed on me. The main thing that makes me follow rules is to avoid the social interaction that often happens when you break the rules. If I think I can get away with something then I'll probably do it.

At one of the schools I went to there was a door that was a shortcut. Students weren't allowed to use this door but teachers were. I couldn't stand that door rule and I went through it religiously because of that. In a world of stupid arbitrary rules that was the one that really made me angry. I can still feel a bit of anger writing about it now.


That reminds me of how I went to a magnet program during high school (which was in a separate building). They locked the male bathroom but keeping the women's open. I came close to peeing on the door of the bathroom(and Im not sure if its unusual that I still find that idea just as funny at 30?) and I actually did use the womens room once after school.



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26 Jun 2023, 7:12 pm

I hate health and safety rules the most. I rather just go by my common sense, and usually if I'm doing something a little risky I 100% know what I'm doing and can be in control without any accidents occurring. Usually with me accidents are caused when not breaking any health and safety rules.

Health and safety used to be a "don't do that, it's not very nice hurting yourself" thing, but nowadays it's more like "I don't care if you die, as long as the business doesn't get sued for it, so try not to die please."


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TheOutsider
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26 Jun 2023, 8:37 pm

I'm a strict rule follower. Rules provide structure and stability in a chaotic and disordered environment.



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27 Jun 2023, 6:31 pm

I used to break a good few rules when I was young. Later on rules didn't get in my way so much and I had less to prove. I don't think about it much these days. When I do, I tend to be careful to avoid too much black-and-white thinking, so I can consider whether or not to bend a rule. A lot of rules are blunt instruments that are best ignored sometimes.



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27 Jun 2023, 6:51 pm

bobert wrote:
I generally like to follow rules if they seem logical, or necessary, but tend to disregard rules if they seem arbitrary, or make no sense.
I think one reason aspies are rule oriented is that rules provide stability in a seemingly chaotic world that can be hard for many of us to understand.


I can appreciate that. I tend to be similar with rules... the ones I cling to I really do, the rest are largely irrelevant to me. I also like structure, predictability and yeah, rules can give that sense of stability in life.



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27 Jun 2023, 7:22 pm

hypercane3 wrote:
I have heard this a lot, but haven't really observed it much in others. I have even seen it described as a virtue when it is anything but. I feel like I don't relate to this symptom at all. And yes, I call it a symptom because rules are often made by organizations that don't have aspies in mind at all at best or at worst are constructs from corporations that only care about their bottom line. I am not a strict rule follower. Rules are a social construct.

Very often, rules can be broken without causing any disruption whatsoever. I have a medical marijuana card and due to housing prices essentially doubling in my region in a year, I really didn't have choice but to sign for the only place I can afford. Can't really move if the prices increase that fast. I have used this treatment since 2019. They say I cannot use marijuana despite it being medical. They cite federal law and all that. Im not surprised. The interests of insurance companies and the like are more important than me as a paying tenant. I smoke outside where it won't disturb my roommates but it is still against the rules. I cannot even go swimming after dusk. I am going into my second year here and have broken both of these rules on a regular basis. How? I do it in a way that isn't disruptive. I smoke somewhere discretely and swim when the security guard leaves to patrol another apartment.

Liability and culture amongst other things has led to corporations creating lots of rules. The fact is that a substantial percentage of people cant afford to live in places where their lives aren't controlled by external humans and inaccurate assumptions (isn't that the aspie dream?). We are going into a time when few people can afford their own property and I fear that those on the spectrum will be the most impacted.

I'm fairly sensory hyposensitive. Maybe the sensory hypersensitive have a different view? I don't care if I hear a pool party by my window at 2am. Id hear it every single night if it meant that I could take a dip when I wanted to at 2am. The noise literally does not phase me in the slightest. If I walk by cigarettes (which I don't smoke), I am so used to it that I don't even notice it.

My current apartment told us (without it being mentioned in the lease) to keep our AC in auto rather than on. It is bad for the system. Roommate wants to obey some maintenance dude, as that is "what the office wants". I really couldn't care less what the office wants, they are mandated by the lease to fix our AC when it breaks and if I want the fan on then I want the fan on. Utility bill isn't high. If it breaks then I will just tell the maintenance team it was on auto the entire time and unexpectedly failed at 72F (that is another stereotype...we apparently cannot tell lies).

I've always had a clash with authority figures and I feel like my Asperger's positively contributes to that instead of negatively and merely being the exception. The idea that people with Asperger's blindly follow rules is some of the strangest BS I have ever heard. It doesn't make sense.

I tend to be a rule-follower because my religion requires its members to obey the rules and laws of man unless the rules and laws keeps us from obeying Jesus.So obeying all rules is just part of my religion generally.