NTs thinking we are doing 'power moves'

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bee33
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26 Nov 2023, 5:23 am

For me, the problem is that I can't manage finesse. I only have two options: blurt out something without finesse, that might offend someone because it's blunt (but not necessarily because of its content), or just not say anything.

I think that's where people who are adept at social interactions can convey a correction or criticism without causing offense, because they know how to sugar-coat it and make it seem palatable. I don't have that ability. Mostly what I have learned to do is to just let it go when other people make a mistake, even when my correction might actually help them. Even if I'm riding in a car with someone and they make a wrong turn, I won't say anything. They'll figure it out eventually.

I can do the dance a little bit by playing dumb, like by saying, "I don't know, I think it might be pronounced mischievous and not mischeevious, but I could be wrong." I might even add, "I think I've heard it both ways," which is technically true even though one of the two ways is wrong.

I think we sometimes just need to let go of things that are wrong and let them play out without correcting them, as much as it chafes.

Also, keep in mind that being corrected bruises a person's ego and can make them feel stupid or embarrassed, which is why they might come to the conclusion that humiliating them was our intention.



KitLily
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26 Nov 2023, 11:01 am

cyberdad wrote:
KitLily wrote:
e.g. when my daughter was little, she told me which kids she wanted to come to her birthday parties. So I invited those kids. Only to find that some of the mothers took offence when I didn't invite their kids. They thought I was doing a 'power move' but I was just trying to make my daughter happy.

What do you think?


This isn't a power move. Little kids always invite everyone in their class to their birthday parties. Those mothers probably took not being invited as rude or snobby.


Exactly! They didn't realise that I was protecting my daughter from their bullying kids, I am not going to force my daughter to be bullied at her own party!

And also saving money by not inviting the whole class. We are not made of money. If they had thought for a moment, they would have realised all those things...

And for the first few years we did invite the whole class...but as I said above, we are not made of money...

People make assumptions, and don't ask for the truth.


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KitLily
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26 Nov 2023, 11:05 am

bee33 wrote:
For me, the problem is that I can't manage finesse. I only have two options: blurt out something without finesse, that might offend someone because it's blunt (but not necessarily because of its content), or just not say anything.

I think we sometimes just need to let go of things that are wrong and let them play out without correcting them, as much as it chafes.

Also, keep in mind that being corrected bruises a person's ego and can make them feel stupid or embarrassed, which is why they might come to the conclusion that humiliating them was our intention.


Same here about finesse.

Yes I'll just have to let people make dangerous mistakes and not say 'well I tried to tell you' when they come to grief. All because they didn't like a bit of embarrassment.

The human race will come to an end like this, I suspect. No one will speak up for fear of embarrassing someone. A great mistake will be made, and awful things will happen. Then some autistic people will be shouting 'we tried to tell you' as the world explodes :lol:

Whereas the thing that humiliates me is when people don't realise I'm trying to help them with something, they misread and they misunderstand. Then they go ahead without my help and end in disaster.

DOH!


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cyberdad
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26 Nov 2023, 4:01 pm

KitLily wrote:
Exactly! They didn't realise that I was protecting my daughter from their bullying kids, I am not going to force my daughter to be bullied at her own party!


My daughter stopped having B/parties in Year 10. It became apparent that
a. kids being invited to our home were not reciprocating invitations to their parties
b. those coming were bullying her at school

The parents of the bullies have the gall to smile at me and send me SMS messages. I ignore them.



funeralxempire
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26 Nov 2023, 4:15 pm

KitLily wrote:
Exactly! They didn't realise that I was protecting my daughter from their bullying kids, I am not going to force my daughter to be bullied at her own party!


The real power move would be telling the terrible moms the real reason to their faces without flinching. That would make you a Gigachad and frontrunner for parent of the year for that year.


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KitLily
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27 Nov 2023, 10:32 am

cyberdad wrote:
My daughter stopped having B/parties in Year 10. It became apparent that
a. kids being invited to our home were not reciprocating invitations to their parties
b. those coming were bullying her at school

The parents of the bullies have the gall to smile at me and send me SMS messages. I ignore them.


Yes, we stopped holding parties when our daughter was about 7 or 8. She said she didn't want any more parties after that. She instead had treats with a best friend or two e.g. going to the cinema. She knows her own mind, she doesn't follow the crowd.

And she realised after a while that her main bully was just a sad little girl with a bad life. The girl's mother is crazy. She moved her kids to France to work on her marriage to their dad and dumped her daughters in French schools where no one spoke English and they were bullied and excluded. The mother refuses to acknowledge her youngest has coeliac disease and feeds her a normal diet. She is a monster. She and another mother ganged up against me and used the threat of not inviting my daughter to their parties as ammunition.

Neither she nor I cared about their stupid mind games and who invited who to who's party. So I'm glad my daughter realised all that and she and I are better off without such people in our lives.


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KitLily
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27 Nov 2023, 10:37 am

funeralxempire wrote:
KitLily wrote:
Exactly! They didn't realise that I was protecting my daughter from their bullying kids, I am not going to force my daughter to be bullied at her own party!


The real power move would be telling the terrible moms the real reason to their faces without flinching. That would make you a Gigachad and frontrunner for parent of the year for that year.


Yes and not doing that is the proof I'm not doing power moves against them. To do that would mean my daughter was bullied and excluded for the rest of her school days, I'm too wise to do that. I pretended to get along with the mothers to ensure my daughter had fun times at parties and events, instead of being the outcast like I am.

I've taken all the sh|t so my daughter doesn't have to. Go me! :ninja:


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cyberdad
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27 Nov 2023, 7:24 pm

KitLily wrote:
Neither she nor I cared about their stupid mind games and who invited who to who's party. So I'm glad my daughter realised all that and she and I are better off without such people in our lives.


Thank you, I am glad I am not the only one who notices that parents are the ones who create spoiled brats who merely reflect the self-centred values of mum and dad.

Since my daughter started kinder I have never been able to engage with parents. I despise the covert/unsaid/quiet competition that goes on whether it be what job they have, what car they drive, how they dress, or how brilliant their little poopkins is.



funeralxempire
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27 Nov 2023, 8:43 pm

KitLily wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
KitLily wrote:
Exactly! They didn't realise that I was protecting my daughter from their bullying kids, I am not going to force my daughter to be bullied at her own party!


The real power move would be telling the terrible moms the real reason to their faces without flinching. That would make you a Gigachad and frontrunner for parent of the year for that year.


Yes and not doing that is the proof I'm not doing power moves against them. To do that would mean my daughter was bullied and excluded for the rest of her school days, I'm too wise to do that. I pretended to get along with the mothers to ensure my daughter had fun times at parties and events, instead of being the outcast like I am.

I've taken all the sh|t so my daughter doesn't have to. Go me! :ninja:


I don't mean it would be a power move in the sense you were referring to, I mean it would demonstrate they hold no power over you.

But, you're right that it would likely result in repercussions for your daughter, so not telling them where they can stick it and how is probably for the best.


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27 Nov 2023, 9:00 pm

Hm. I never thought about it as a power move. I'm not really sure if I understand what a power move is. I know that one year I didn't invite the whole class to my oldest daughter's b-day party and a lot of the kids had their feelings hurt, but my mindset was simple, some of the kids were not only not her friends, but some of them were mean to her and she didn't want them there. Seemed simple to me. I tried to be discreet about it so no one would know they were being excluded, but it was a small school and the kids talked and found out and it was a mess. I just figured it was kids having their feelings hurt and parents doing what they do when their kid gets hurt...reacting. Now I wonder if there was more to it. Reality was that the parents in her class didn't like me. I was a single parent at the time, and my kids were in a christian school back then and I am an athiest. A lot of the parents in her class didn't like me to begin with. My middle daughter had other single parents who were only there to give there kids a safer school environment than our public schools, so I got on well with most of them and their kids played with mine a lot. I could relate to more of them. Very different dynamics with those two daughters and elementary school. I figured it was cliques with adults impacting the kids. It's likely though there was more that I was missing. I'm not the most socially savvy.

I know that a lot of times when people meet me, they seem to like me, but the more they get to know me, the more off-putting I become to them. I figure it's because I can be 'a lot'. I don't bite my tongue, and I unapologetically am who I am. Initially that is refreshing to people, and they enjoy it, but once they realize this is how I always am, they run. Lol. I know small doses of me is best for others. I just figured I was too much, but maybe they think I'm trying to pull rank or be superior or something. I dunno. I could ask some of the people who have run from me, but I doubt they'd respond to my texts. Now I'm curious.



KitLily
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28 Nov 2023, 7:28 am

cyberdad wrote:
Thank you, I am glad I am not the only one who notices that parents are the ones who create spoiled brats who merely reflect the self-centred values of mum and dad.

Since my daughter started kinder I have never been able to engage with parents. I despise the covert/unsaid/quiet competition that goes on whether it be what job they have, what car they drive, how they dress, or how brilliant their little poopkins is.


I think a lot of people have kids to: boast/ show off/ follow the herd/ have a smaller version of themselves/ just biological broodiness to have a baby (they don't think further than that).

A lot of people don't see their kids as actual people, they are there to serve a purpose for the parents.

My mum just 'wanted a baby'. Once I became able to function without her, she lost interest in me. :roll:


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KitLily
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28 Nov 2023, 7:33 am

funeralxempire wrote:
I don't mean it would be a power move in the sense you were referring to, I mean it would demonstrate they hold no power over you.

But, you're right that it would likely result in repercussions for your daughter, so not telling them where they can stick it and how is probably for the best.


Ah right I see! Oh yes I'd love to give them a piece of my mind. But I am alone here. They could make me and my family's life VERY difficult. We're moving soon though, I'll be happy to leave them behind.

Thanks.


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KitLily
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28 Nov 2023, 7:38 am

FleaOfTheChill wrote:
Hm. I never thought about it as a power move. I'm not really sure if I understand what a power move is. I know that one year I didn't invite the whole class to my oldest daughter's b-day party and a lot of the kids had their feelings hurt, but my mindset was simple, some of the kids were not only not her friends, but some of them were mean to her and she didn't want them there. Seemed simple to me. I tried to be discreet about it so no one would know they were being excluded, but it was a small school and the kids talked and found out and it was a mess. I just figured it was kids having their feelings hurt and parents doing what they do when their kid gets hurt...reacting. Now I wonder if there was more to it...It's likely though there was more that I was missing. I'm not the most socially savvy.

I know that a lot of times when people meet me, they seem to like me, but the more they get to know me, the more off-putting I become to them. I figure it's because I can be 'a lot'. I don't bite my tongue, and I unapologetically am who I am. Initially that is refreshing to people, and they enjoy it, but once they realize this is how I always am, they run. Lol. I know small doses of me is best for others. I just figured I was too much, but maybe they think I'm trying to pull rank or be superior or something. I dunno. I could ask some of the people who have run from me, but I doubt they'd respond to my texts. Now I'm curious.


I was the same with the school/parents/social thing. I didn't understand the complex social situation and just invited who my daughter said she wanted to invite.

I think it's good you are yourself. I'm so busy working out what people want me to say, what I should say, what I shouldn't say, that I end up saying something stupid anyway.

Maybe it's the same with me- at first my bluntness is refreshing, then I am too blunt. Or I have a meltdown, and people can't cope and run for the hills. Especially English people. They cannot stand emotions. Anyone having an emotion must be avoided in this country- don't ask, don't try to help, just RUN! Off to the calm people.

I've noticed that French, Italian and Spanish people can handle emotions easily and don't get fazed.

I just think that the other person who made this point about 'power moves' could be right- NTs are obsessed with ranks, hierarchies, who is higher up and lower down. They might be reading NDs as doing the same thing, when we're not.


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KitLily
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28 Nov 2023, 7:44 am

I want to give some other examples of NTs thinking Autists are doing power moves. People are getting too distracted by my example of the school parties and parenting.

1. At work. Correcting people's mistakes and doing our jobs efficiently and quietly. I was amazed when I got my first job and found out that many people don't come to work to get the job done. For a lot of them, it's socialising and jockeying for position that are the most important thing. Also schmoozing to get a promotion. I found that if I was too nice to some people, others assumed I wanted a promotion.

2. Generally correcting people. I want to make sure people have the correct information in case the wrong information hurts them. And of course I like information to be correct as much as possible. Could this be seen as a power move to undermine someone of a higher social standing than me? There was one stupid example where I complimented the outfit of a fellow 'playground mum' and she took high offence and was rude to me from then on.

Any other situations/examples?


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28 Nov 2023, 8:03 am

Number 3 might be people who make themselves indispensable to their bosses by being everywhere and volunteering to do everything but don't actually do any work. They then get given leadership roles that they are not qualified to hold and promotions they don't deserve.



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28 Nov 2023, 9:08 am

It is said that Clemons Van Metternich (the famous Austrian diplomat of the 19th Century) suffered...a fit of depression... after he learned that "the Russian embassador had just died". Depression because Metternich couldnt figure out what the embassador's....motive...could be.

Motive for dying.

Obviously it was a "powerplay", but how? :lol:

European diplomats of the Napoleonic age were to normal NTs, what normal NTs are to autistics. Play court intrigue on a higher level ...like three D chess.