The US Government Shut-Down - Whom to Blame

Post Reply New Topic

I will wear his scorn as a badge of pride.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Go for it. 90% of the government is still functioning and we're actually spending more money to keep national parks and monuments closed, it's so pointless I don't see why it would scare anybody. Pure political theater. All those poor "non-essential" federal workers are getting a nice paid vacation, boo hoo. They're trying to tie the debt ceiling into it now but that's on them. I don't think we should raise the debt limit, we should prioritize spending. I'll refer to the junior Senator of Illinois back in 2006 on the debt ceiling

"The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies. … Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that “the buck stops here.” Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better."

In 2010 the GOP was given a mandate by the American people to stop Obamacare which was passed without precedent. As we heard when congressional Democrats were crafting the bill, elections has consequences. This is one of them. The GOP has been willing to compromise, just delay the law 1 year(not like anybody has even signed up for it yet ) and make the 2014 midterms a referendum on Obamacare. Do you think the American people will support it? Rand Paul even supports a short "clean" CR to give time to negotiate. It's unavoidable, Obama is playing politics refusing to even meet with congressional Republicans.

Absolutely false.


False again.


People have been signing up since October 1.


The defeat of Mr. Romney was the referendum. No need to keep harping about it. Obamacare is a done deal.


They already have. Or, Mr. Romney would be president.


There is nothing to negotiate.


There is nothing to discuss.

The so-called "moderate" Repugs have shown themselves to be irresponsible here.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/most-irre ... 53584.html

Rip Van Winkle lives. Time has moved on. In 2012 the Democrats picked up 8 House seats, 2 Senate seats and the Presidency. Obamacare was passed legally and survived the SC challenge. It's over. Time to deal with reality.

I got into a discussion in church this past Sunday with two members of the property committee, one of which has a granddaughter on the spectrum. They both agreed with me on the points I made earlier in this topic, except they felt that a 1% flat income tax with no deductions was too small. They feel that it should be be anywhere between 15 to 17% and eliminate all state, local and sales tax. I had to remind them that there are certain rights, like education and transportation that the states are responsible for funding. They also agree that corporations should pay a higher tax rate, and be heavily penalized with a 95% tax rate! like Eisenhower proposed during his presidency, and not be allowed to write off losses or business expenses. Ditto for those that invest in the stock market. if they lose their money gambling on the market, that's their problem. the only thing we didn't agree on was a national sales tax. I still say a .05% sales tax on a all goods and services and a 1% flat income tax on individuals and a 10% flat tax on corporations will have so much money rolling in that Congress couldn't spend it fast enough, which is why the President needs a line item veto and a Balanced budget amendment on discretionary spending to keep the spending in check.

They then started in on the so-called Obama phones. If it weren't for the fact that it was reporting time for the choir in order to do a final run-through of the anthem for the day, I would have reminded them that the free phone were not of Obama's doing. Thar program, IIRC, dates back to the Reagan Administration.

That happened over 150 years ago. It was called the Civil War.

Just to add fuel to the fire, I got this piece of information from The Ed Show on MS-NBC this afternoon. It seems the truckers are not too happy with the Government shutdown. They are planning a massive slowdown of traffic on all the major thorofares around DC. As a matter of fact, they're so pissed off, they are thinking about taking siege of congress, the White House and the justice department, and placing all of our leaders under Citizen's arrest and having them tried for treason.

So I should be grateful that he put one semi-valid link about gerrymandering in a half page of failed fisking? I mean I understand that this is an improvement on his usual standard, but that hardly invalidates my point, which was more about Kraichgauer's uncritical acceptance of any statement trashing conservatives or praising liberals that about AP in the first place.

And yet according to you, liberals can do no right.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

there is just no dealing with people who believe wholeheartedly in the horatio alger meme.

I tend to see the conservative party as being the more intelligent and logical of the two evils. That doesn't mean I support either one though that to me would be the height of stupidity in my opinion.

The families of the soldiers that have died during this cannot even get their death benefits.
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10 ... allen?lite

if and when we make it through this extortion, there needs to be wholesale changes in laws which would prevent this from ever happening again.

Really? The Republican party is home to the people who deny evolution, and the geologic age of the earth. And instead of just putting such persons on the sidelines with a pat on the head, the Republican party has allowed itself to be dominated by them. That hardly sounds logical or intelligent to me.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Really? I was so sure that I voted for Obama the first time because I thought he was a liberal; guess I was mistaken in both cases. Same for all those other times I've voted Democrat, or stuck up for progressive ideas...

Lately, that fact is hard to remember.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer