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CentralFLM
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13 Sep 2007, 9:25 am

My wife is leaving me. Actually, she said it was over a year ago, but said she had nothing else to give over a year and a half ago. Needless to say, she was my first girlfriend and I met her when I was 23. I met her over the internet a state away even though I was living in a college town of over 20,000 women.
Everything that happened in our NT-AS marriage is what they say happens in the books. I started to become more needy, more childlike, and that wall grew bigger and bigger between us. I went through 3 jobs while being together because of social issues. I wouldn't go to bed with her most nights because I would go stem on the internet until 3am in the morning. A common trait with Aspie's is that our internal clock is messed up. She would cry and beg (I just didn't understand why she was so sensitive or maybe there was something wrong with her). However, she didn't make as much of an issue about it until the last year. I had always been that way! I just didn't suddenly do it. I also have a very hard time with porn on the internet. She told me to stop and I told her I would. I really really wanted to, but the desire would creep up again. Also, she said that I just didn't look at her the way she wanted to be looked at (I'm sure you guys can relate to this one). She said I should pray about it, which I did.
We have a 1 year old baby who was actually conceived before she made the final decision to dump me. She cried when she found out we were having a baby. Let me just say that my wife has a lot of issues to. She was molested as a kid and lost her mother in a tragic fire and her father to cancer. She has told me that I have always been there for her with this issue. I went on line to find past relatives in the past. I cared for her. I loved her and she knows I love her.
A year and a half ago when she basically was through with me, she told me all these things I needed to do to have a chance with her. She told me to go to a counselor, put a porn blocker up, go to bed with her, and go to Men's Group at church. Keep in mind that I didn't know I had AS. I immediately went to a Christian counselor. A half year into it I asked him if he thought I had AS and he said no. He didn't do any research, so I just assumed he was right until I got a book on it. I felt like he did me a disservice. I did start going to bed with my wife, but she was like a cold rock in bed with me. She would just turn her back on me, so eventually I started to stay up later and started to stem. "She didn't have anything else to give." I did put a blocker on and went months without looking at porn. I did slip up which of course my wife saw (of course keep in mind she is refusing sex with me for months upon months...but she doesn't understand). I did finally go to the Men's Group, 8 months later. I just had so much anxiety being around people (Can you relate? :oops:) I did attempt to earlier in the year, but I got lost in church and couldn't find the room. I had problems asking people where it was at. I know it is a bad excuse.
Eventually I find out she has feelings for another guy at work (turns out he is with someone else). The marriage was over before any of these because of my AS. Oh, keep in mind that she refused to go to marriage counseling with me. How can she bring a baby into this world and not even try for her sake? How can she look at her baby knowing that she didn't do everything possible?
I have a few questions:
1. Can you share your stories of marriage with us and how do you deal with it or has your marriage ended in divorce?
2. Am I all to blame? Can i blame the AS partially or maybe even fully for my divorce?
3. After a year and a half, and still loving her, is it the AS talking when I think I still love her?
4. Should I let her go in my heart?
5. If she does leave me for good (waiting for house to sell) should I wait several years before attempting another relationship?
Should I really should forget about having a relationship again? Do I really want to hurt another woman I love by not being able to show her the affection she needs?
6. Should I even consider marrying another NT woman or should I look for another AS partner (like my parents). Of course the odds are sacked against me 3 to 1.



wsmac
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13 Sep 2007, 9:53 am

Sorry to hear about your situation, but it seems like it is not too uncommon.

I don't have AS, I have ADD/HD and that did cause quite a few problems in my 14 yr marriage/17yr relationship with my wife.

I don't go to church (gave up on that long ago), so I can't give you any GODLY advice... but as hard as it may seem, if she cannot tolerate or appreciate your AS, then I would tend to think things won't ever work out.
You talk about her issues... I found the same things in my marriage, but I was "the only one with a problem".

I also have experienced what you did with the counselor at church. Not to disparage all church goers, but what I have seen is that some folks who are deeply rooted in their religion tend to not believe the impact of having AS or ADD/HD, etc., on someone's life.
"Just pray and put your trust in GOD!", they say. :roll: I've spoken to GOD so much in my life I'm now on his BLOCKED list! :wink:

Come to terms with 'being' AS, appreciate the good things about it and find ways to deal, as best you can, with the more unpleasant things. That's what I do with my silly old brain.

You'll find lots of posts about relationships for Aspies here. I'm not the one to dispense advice regarding that.

Please don't be too hard on yourself though... Blame the AS? Well, I think it's more of an acceptance that your brain functions in a different way than hers, or lots of other folks. You are not broken, but our society hasn't come around to seeing people with AS, ADD/DH, Autism, etc. as being normal in their own right.

Hang out here instead of the porn places if they are not good for you... this place is certainly good! :D

As far as your kid...

As she grows up and you start reading to her (although I read to our daughter from the beginning), find kid's books on AS and read them to her.

I was shown one yesterday, "All Cats Have Asperger Syndrome", and it is a really great book with cute kitties in it.

You want your child to learn from early on that humans come in a variety of personalities but each one is equal to the other.

From what I have read and seen, the theory is that fathers with AS tend to be a bit more distant from their kids than mothers with AS.
You just have to teach her that no matter how you behave day-to-day, you Love her and respect her as your daughter and a person.

I wish you well!


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Last edited by wsmac on 13 Sep 2007, 10:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

CentralFLM
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13 Sep 2007, 10:01 am

Thank you. I have at times been in deep depression and sadness over this. I have gotten into even deeper sadness now that I know I have AS. I use to have the hope that I could fix myself and be socially in tune, but now I know it is a dream. I would be lying if I didn't say I have been questioning God about this. Why didn't He show me that I had AS earlier in my life, my marriage, during my problems. If my wife knew I had AS she may have not been hurt so much because she would have known that I wasn't trying to hurt her on purpose. Why didn't God tell me about this AS in the beginning of 06?
I have to ask myself, "do I blame her"? I think about how I am and I don't blame her for wanting to leave for her emotional sanity. How can I fault her for being one of the only few people who attempted to love me? I can't.



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13 Sep 2007, 10:11 am

Hmmm, as far as GOD goes... one expression I have heard repeated more often than "Hail Mary...", is that "GOD works in mysterious ways!"

I guess with your beliefs, you might see this as some sort of plan GOD has for you.

I'm not bashing religion of any kind, I see where it has helped MANY people.
I guess I'm just not too crazy with all the humans running around here mis-interpreting spirituality and religion :wink:

Perhaps you need to find a church that is more open to the human experiences in life and how hard it is to cope here on earth?

As far as 'fixing' yourself... don't bother! I'll repeat myself... YOU ARE NOT BROKEN! It is society and the medical community at large who need 'fixing'!

Looking at things from a religious perspective...

There is diversity in all living things (as well as non-living things like rocks :D ) and this diversity is usually accepted as wonderful and beautiful... say... with plants!

Humans are so screwed up about each other that diversity isn't universally appreciated.

You could say GOD put this diversity in everything and therefore we should appreciate it all... even the human diversity present.

This may not lift you out of your depression over your current situation, but please try to change YOUR mindset about YOUR SELF!
:D


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CentralFLM
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13 Sep 2007, 10:15 am

Thanks for the advice. My wife was my connection to the NT World. I was able to live "sort of" in the NT world through her. She had that drive to be with her family, go to church, go to dinner with coworkers, get an apartment, by a house, go on vacation, etc. I didn't really enjoy a lot of these events and sometimes I did pass on the dinner with coworkers, but I still got joy out of seeing her enjoying these things. Now it is all going to go away. I can't picture myself going on vacation alone and it will even be difficult with my daughter. Losing her is like losing my life. I always have her there. Now I'm going to alone again stuck in the same room with myself. I dread the day our house sells.



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13 Sep 2007, 10:21 am

Hang in there man, it does get better. There are no kids involved in my situation which is probably why I haven't seen my ex-wife for about twelve years. I went through a lot of the same things as you (including the stone cold rock in the bed) but the reasons for the divorce were different. Anyway, to answer your questions:

1. Can you share your stories of marriage with us and how do you deal with it or has your marriage ended in divorce?
See above. The good news is that I've now found someone else but we are NOT married.

2. Am I all to blame? Can i blame the AS partially or maybe even fully for my divorce?
Most of the cases are 50/50, and remember that she's found another man whilst you have remained faithful. Having said that, the porn probably didn't help and you may find it mentioned in the divorce papers.

3. After a year and a half, and still loving her, is it the AS talking when I think I still love her?
Probably.

4. Should I let her go in my heart?
Probably. A few marriages recover from this sort of thing but not many. Hearts heal over time.

5. If she does leave me for good (waiting for house to sell) should I wait several years before attempting another relationship?
Why wait years? Two months after my divorce I was in another relationship and I seem to remember we had some fun times.

Should I really should forget about having a relationship again? Do I really want to hurt another woman I love by not being able to show her the affection she needs?
If you find a woman who understands you and is willing to accept you the way you are then things will probably work out.

6. Should I even consider marrying another NT woman or should I look for another AS partner (like my parents). Of course the odds are sacked against me 3 to 1.
Your call. Living with someone is not looked down upon as much as it was and it's a far safer option. NT or AS, it doesn't matter, it's the person within that counts.

Ed Almos



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13 Sep 2007, 10:49 am

I thought my wife (the papers aren't finalized yet so I still use that term) and I would remain friends and we would go to a mediator to work things out.

The 'nice divorce' idea didn't last long though.

She tried to use several things from my past and present to claim that I was... "unfit to be even a part-time parent" (her words in court), and have sole-custody of our daughter.

Thankfully, the court realized I had been the 'stay-at-home' Dad for our daughter's entire life and had done a fairly decent job of it while maintaining the home and working part-time.

Basically, I'm trying to let you know that you should make every effort to keep your daughter in your life.

I agree with edal that the 'porn' issue will probably come out in the court papers she files.
I hope I'm wrong.

From what I have learned about people with AS, they tend to be a bit more of the gullible sort than NT's.
eta: just from what some Aspies have said about being lied to and not realizing it
BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU GIVE UP AND WHAT YOU AGREE TO!

Don't let your grief and despair cause you to walk away from what you deserve to have.

Now, I don't know your story other than what you've posted, but if everything is the way you stated, then you should not let feelings of guilt or shame drive you into submitting to whatever she and her lawyer (assuming she has one)... oh... and family & friends (they seem to think the divorce is THEIRS TOO! :roll: ) are advising her to seek.

The kid NEEDS both of you! So child custody is of MAJOR IMPORTANCE!

Just because you have AS and look at porn on the internet, does NOT make you a bad parent!

You are here seeking answers.
You will be given lots of advice and resources here that will help you... I hope.
So this is a sign that you are interested in being a good person and a good parent!

Take heed in that!
:D


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CentralFLM
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13 Sep 2007, 11:04 am

Thank you guys for the advice. My wife said that when she files she will do it under irreconcilable differences. A while back I thought to myself that I would not sign anything because it goes against my religious principles, but the more I think about it the more I think I should just sign it if she puts it that way instead of letting it go on with mud slinging.
.



Cooper
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13 Sep 2007, 11:23 am

I think you should go to a secular counselor or psychologist who knows more about AS for advice to help you be the best parent that you can and to help you in future relationships. I think you should let your wife go in your heart, because if you don't, you'll become bitter as she moves on, and that isn't a good situation for your child. If she refused marriage counseling, then you definitely don't hold all the blame for the relationship's failure, but please realize that marriage counseling can't save a marriage that truly doesn't work. It can only heal one that's having problems, so it may not have changed things anyway. Also, make sure you go slowly in terms of commitment in your next relationship, so that you can be sure that the other partner really understands your AS and accepts it. Best of luck.



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13 Sep 2007, 11:27 am

Cooper wrote:
... because if you don't, you'll become bitter as she moves on...


Sorry, but I really dislike blanket statements like this.

He MAY become bitter, he MAY not.

Otherwise, you gave some GREAT advice!

In a much shorter post than I ever could too! :D


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Cooper
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13 Sep 2007, 11:32 am

You're right, that was too general. Sorry if it offended you, CentralFLM, I didn't mean to presume how you would think or react.



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13 Sep 2007, 11:32 am

I'm a woman with AS and I was married to an NT man for 3 years (together for 6). It was a terrible match and we shouldn't have been together in the first place...I'm the one who left him. I'm now married to a man who has ADHD and it's a much better match. It's not like things are perfect, but we understand each other a lot better.



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13 Sep 2007, 12:25 pm

First, let me say I am sorry. Divorce sucks, I've been through one. I am the one who initiated it, it never got nasty or went through court (just filed and signed the papers) but it was still an awful feeling. But on the brighter side, time does heal much of that.

CentralFLM wrote:
I wouldn't go to bed with her most nights because I would go stem on the internet until 3am in the morning. A common trait with Aspie's is that our internal clock is messed up. She would cry and beg (I just didn't understand why she was so sensitive or maybe there was something wrong with her).


This is why I have to stay up to all hours researching a topic half to death? I literally cannot sleep until I reach a stopping point. I'm married to an aspie now, but my ex, it didn't fly with him at ALL. We would have huge arguments because he would say, "Your damn computer is more important to you than I am!" Which wasn't true, but I can see in hindsight how an NT might feel that way. I have a passion for HTML programming, and I spent hours on it. Then I started college and that ate the rest of my free time. It's not that I didn't care, I just felt like he was needy and smothering me, so eventually I had to leave - for my own sake and for his.

CentralFLM wrote:
Let me just say that my wife has a lot of issues to. She was molested as a kid and lost her mother in a tragic fire and her father to cancer. She has told me that I have always been there for her with this issue. I went on line to find past relatives in the past. I cared for her. I loved her and she knows I love her.


Clearly the problem isn't all yours. That is a big burden to carry, and I suspect she expected you to help her carry it. Did she seek counseling for any of this? You're not dealing with just the typical strains of an NT/AS relationship here, she has additional needs which probably accumulated to a disasterous strain on both of you without some outside intervention.

CentralFLM wrote:
A year and a half ago when she basically was through with me, she told me all these things I needed to do to have a chance with her. She told me to go to a counselor, put a porn blocker up, go to bed with her, and go to Men's Group at church. Keep in mind that I didn't know I had AS. I immediately went to a Christian counselor. A half year into it I asked him if he thought I had AS and he said no. He didn't do any research, so I just assumed he was right until I got a book on it. I felt like he did me a disservice. I did start going to bed with my wife, but she was like a cold rock in bed with me. She would just turn her back on me, so eventually I started to stay up later and started to stem. "She didn't have anything else to give." I did put a blocker on and went months without looking at porn. I did slip up which of course my wife saw (of course keep in mind she is refusing sex with me for months upon months...but she doesn't understand). I did finally go to the Men's Group, 8 months later. I just had so much anxiety being around people (Can you relate? :oops:) I did attempt to earlier in the year, but I got lost in church and couldn't find the room. I had problems asking people where it was at. I know it is a bad excuse.


I'm sure people will disagree with me here, but the only reason you should go to christian counseling is if your problem is related to your OWN beliefs/faith or you feel that spiritual guidance is needed to reconcile your relationship with god/christ. I sought counseling from a christian-based women's center after my first pregnancy ended, and it led my off a healing path and filled me with feelings of guilt about everything in my life. I was told if I just gave my sadness to Jesus, he'd fix it. My pain and grief were never addressed. Similarly here I think the person you spoke to did you a disservice by casting off any thoughts about the AS possibility. That is something only a professional therapist should answer, a religious person has no authority to do so, and it causes problems (and delays in getting help) when they do.

And now, I'm sorry but if someone wasn't having sex for months with me, I might be looking at porn too! I'm not saying porn addiction is healthy - certainly it's not - but there's not something inherently wrong with a guy looking at some sexually oriented material (the legal stuff, of course, lol) once in a while when he's gone through months of a drought. Personal opinion, I know not everyone feels this way. I think the bigger issue here may have been your wife's inability to reconcile her past abuses, thus she had difficulty with that material and found it offensive. If you two had been having a healthy sexual relationship (i.e. not months of nada) I would say okay, you were a jerk for looking up the porn. But you know, not in this case.

I think the marriage counseling you wanted would have helped both of you to understand each other and come to an agreement about the amount of acceptable sexual materials and so forth. I think she had her mind made up and just wanted to guilt trip you.

CentralFLM wrote:
Eventually I find out she has feelings for another guy at work (turns out he is with someone else). The marriage was over before any of these because of my AS. Oh, keep in mind that she refused to go to marriage counseling with me. How can she bring a baby into this world and not even try for her sake? How can she look at her baby knowing that she didn't do everything possible?


It sounds like your wife is selfish. She's guilting you for looking at porn, blaming you for the fall of our relationship, demanding you change...while she's got feelings for an actual other person - who is with someone else? Yikes man.

CentralFLM wrote:
I have a few questions:
1. Can you share your stories of marriage with us and how do you deal with it or has your marriage ended in divorce?
2. Am I all to blame? Can i blame the AS partially or maybe even fully for my divorce?


NO!! !! You are not all to blame!! !! You can perhaps blame some of the AS, sure, but your wife's demands and needy behaviors and refusal to meet you half way (she expected you to do all the changing, never acknowledging any of her own problems) also contributed. As for sharing, I explained above :wink:

CentralFLM wrote:
3. After a year and a half, and still loving her, is it the AS talking when I think I still love her?


No, you probably still love her. Sounds like she ws your first love and you've shared a lot together. Maybe a part of you will always love her, no matter how much you come to terms with the rest of this. And that's okay. You don't have to change your feelings, and you couldn't anyway. Feelings are what they are.

CentralFLM wrote:
4. Should I let her go in my heart?


I think that is your heart's decision.

CentralFLM wrote:
5. If she does leave me for good (waiting for house to sell) should I wait several years before attempting another relationship?
Should I really should forget about having a relationship again? Do I really want to hurt another woman I love by not being able to show her the affection she needs?


The man I am married to now is on the spectrum too. Oh, we have our problems, mostly in communication - but we get each other in ways no one else ever could. I met him about one year after my divorce. We clicked so well we married six months later. We've been together 7 years and have two wonderful children together. We're both proof that you (a) do not have to wait forever and (b) there is hope out there of finding your match. Don't give up on relationships! I did, I swore I'd never marry again - then I met my husband and everything changed. I don't think you'll "hurt" another woman. You're viewing yourself as defective. Please stop. You're not some defective thing pointed at injuring women you love, her demands have made you feel this way. I'm not dismissing you from responsibility, I'm just saying it was both of you and you are an aspie. I believe your caring nature is evidenced in this post and I think you do have the potential to have a positive relationship if you find the right person. One failed relationship (which wasn't 100% your failing) does not doom all others. Just keep yourself open to the opportunity, and don't see yourself as defective, because you're not. Different does not equal defective.

CentralFLM wrote:
6. Should I even consider marrying another NT woman or should I look for another AS partner (like my parents). Of course the odds are sacked against me 3 to 1.


Isn't there an aspie singles room on this site? lol In all seriousness, I think that meeting the right person might be another aspie - but hey - there is evidence of very happy AS/NT relationships here. It requires patience and understanding, but ALL relationships do.

Hang in there. As a fellow aspie who has been through a divorce, I promise it does get better if you let it.


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13 Sep 2007, 5:45 pm

CentralFLM wrote:
1. Can you share your stories of marriage with us and how do you deal with it or has your marriage ended in divorce?
2. Am I all to blame? Can i blame the AS partially or maybe even fully for my divorce?
3. After a year and a half, and still loving her, is it the AS talking when I think I still love her?
4. Should I let her go in my heart?
5. If she does leave me for good (waiting for house to sell) should I wait several years before attempting another relationship?
Should I really should forget about having a relationship again? Do I really want to hurt another woman I love by not being able to show her the affection she needs?
6. Should I even consider marrying another NT woman or should I look for another AS partner (like my parents). Of course the odds are sacked against me 3 to 1.


1. I've been married twice, and both ended in divorce. They were both enjoyable overall while they lasted.

2. You can't think in terms of blame, really. Unless you were abusive or deceptive, she should have known what she was getting when she agreed to marry you. I'm guessing that she was simply young and immature, and didn't account for the reality of being married. Young people change a great deal. Is the AS to blame? Insomuch as you perhaps developed maladaptive responses to her, and didn't respond the way she might expect a "normal" person to.

3. I can't answer that. Do you still consistently long to hold her and be with her?

4. Yes. It doesn't sound like she's going to change her mind, and though it may feel romantic to pine for her, it's unproductive and painful.

5. That's a tough call. I've been single now for about a year, and I'm still not all that interested in someone new. I'm sure I will be. I would suggest that you try to learn from this breakup when dating women in the future, so you don't repeat the same relationship. It's easy to fall back into the same dynamic with a new person and delude yourself into thinking that the fundamentals are different. Be choosier and take things slowly.

6. I'd like to try dating an aspie, but it seems unlikely. There are NT girls that share some overlap with aspies, though. Girls who are odd and engaging for different reasons. Don't limit yourself.

Overall, I'd say that it hurts to lose someone you love, but you'll get over it. You're not defective or wrong, you just need to find someone who's interested in more than the initial safety and comfort they get from you. It's easy to fall into a relationship with someone if you're easily flattered by the attention you get from it. It's harder to think objectively about whether or not this person will be compatible with you in the long run. It's often the crazy ones that come on strong out of the gate, and seem to push things along quickly. You're probably a safe person to them, and that's nice... for a while.



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13 Sep 2007, 10:23 pm

Quote:
1. Can you share your stories of marriage with us and how do you deal with it or has your marriage ended in divorce?
2. Am I all to blame? Can i blame the AS partially or maybe even fully for my divorce?
3. After a year and a half, and still loving her, is it the AS talking when I think I still love her?
4. Should I let her go in my heart?
5. If she does leave me for good (waiting for house to sell) should I wait several years before attempting another relationship?
Should I really should forget about having a relationship again? Do I really want to hurt another woman I love by not being able to show her the affection she needs?
6. Should I even consider marrying another NT woman or should I look for another AS partner (like my parents). Of course the odds are sacked against me 3 to 1.


1. 10 years...officially the marriage lasted 2 years, but obviously I had not learned my lesson the first time and went back a year later after the divorce. I was "cold", "uncaring"...our son would never have a "normal" life due to "my" lack of social skills...he told his relatives I was "whacked", "crazy", "nuts" etc. He constantly accused me of cheating on him...when in reality it was he who was doing the cheating. I stayed because my son loved his dad...and no matter how much he$$ I dealt with...he was good with our son. I was also very gullible. The "nuclear explosion" occurred last July. He's been living with his girlfriend since then...I am healing.

2. Do NOT blame yourself!! You are who you are and she is who she is...we can't change who we are. Sometimes two people don't find out they are toxic to one another until it's too late. I admit my aspie traits probably drove my ex nuts...but dealing with his superior attitude, verbal abuse, and him running around didn't help.

3. I never "stopped" loving him completely. Strange as that may sound to some. I don't know how anyone CAN love someone and suddenly just shut off that switch totally. I believe you always have some feelings...but you have the common sense to say "this is bad for me, this will not work". That said I also could use some anger management some days too...it's a mixed thing.

4. Let her go? As much as you can...you need to heal. Learn to love yourself for who you are...love your daughter for who she is.

5. That is up to you. Basically myself I'm planning on joining the crazy old cat lady society...I have no desire at this point in my life to try marriage again...but life's surprising, I never planned to get married at all.

Please don't distance yourself from your daughters life...she needs to know both her father and her mother care about her very much. My son spends weekends with his dad...he does alot of socializing with dad and the extended family...things that I'm not real skilled at...but we do things together (computers, photography, home projects) that dad isn't too skilled in either...it evens out. You have alot to give as a parent...don't sell yourself short.


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ADoyle
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Joined: 16 Dec 2005
Age: 48
Gender: Female
Posts: 913
Location: Southern California, USA

13 Sep 2007, 11:54 pm

1. I was briefly married to an abusive NT, and it's a good thing I wasn't diagnosed as Aspie then as he had said some pretty nasty things about people with disabilities. He also said that I was "psychotic" and that my depression which does run in my family was really "manipulation." He also blamed me for everything that went wrong in his life, even things I had no control over. I filed the papers myself, and somehow it didn't have to go to court because he surprised me by signing them since he had a major fit when I filed. Fortunately, I didn't have any children with him, so I was able to make a clean break and haven't seen or heard from him since a memorial service for a mutual friend who died of Hodgekin's 4 years ago.

2. You are NOT to blame! Sometimes marriages don't work out even if there's no abuse of any kind.

3. She was your first love, and despite the fact that the relationship ended in divorce, you might always love her.

4. That's up to you

5. I'm now with someone who I think has Aspie traits, but we're not married as both of us want to be secure in our careers first before marriage and possible children. It's definitely possible to have a healthy relationship after a divorce.


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"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason,
and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."
- Galileo Galilei