Sperm donor was AS

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Lying for sex isn't exclusively a NT thing.. and FRAUD is a crime.

you have a point.

Taking all the emotion and morality out of it, Charloz, if you read my other posts, you will know that I think your approach here is counterproductive to the goals you've stated in your most recent posts.

I will repeat: how this will play out in the NT world is, I strongly believe, counterproductive to your stated goals. My instinct on this is really strong, and my instincts are rarely wrong.

Be ware the law of unintended consequences. You are making a lot of missteps that in my experience are likely to get you burned. I tried to explain or at least hint at much of how in my earlier posts. Do I expect you to believe me? Not really. But someday, I sincerely believe, you will look back and understand what I meant.

I will say that the most interesting and possibly effective argument you've made is that it seems to you like the most severe autism cases are cropping out of nowhere, born to two NT parents. I'm not sure that is statistically born out (in fact, I am 80% sure it is NOT), if it were, that is the only thing I've read of what you've written that could change the formula. But ... I think you are wrong on that. The cases I know of severe autism are all in families with clear spectrum history, albeit mild enough to have gotten "by," married, and reproduced.

Personally, I think that a big reason for potential mothers to know about the ASD is that those who have it already in their own families should probably think twice about combining potential ASD genes with potential ASD genes. While they would probably be the best mothers for an ASD child, the combination also creates the most risk of severe, life-limiting, forms of autism. Those are the women who would know and understand how to weight it, and would probably take the risk knowingly. They should have that choice. I would consider it a shame if sperm banks are not allowing complete and full disclosure of the history, and rejecting based just on the one word, but is your method the best way to change that? I really, really do not think so. I really, really think you are hurting the cause more.

I agree with DW_a_mom but think you might not have thought it through in other ways disregarding AS. I'm very family oriented as I come from a close family. I'd assumed you would be the opposite from your actions but some of your posts about your parents have made me question this. You need to let your parents know what you have done as you have set in motion a scenario where grandkids they didn't know about will come knocking on their door (and yours) in the future. Sperm donation is dropping precisely because there is no guarantee of anonymity for the donor once the child comes of age. There was a TV series, Generation cryo I think, that showed the search some of the kids go through.
These kids will be brothers and sisters to any kids you have with your fiancee and nieces and nephews to your siblings. They are not political statements but living breathing people who might have your dad's eyes or your mum's nose and they will come looking for family. You are in a position where you don't get to vet who gets to be in your family or safeguard the kind of life your children will have. You just have to hope that the women buying your batch are good people and all the people in their lives treat your child well and raise them right as you will not be there. If your parents are anything like mine, the knowledge that their flesh and blood is out there wandering in the world without them will hurt them. Your fiancee will also not be pleased.

There are also plenty of surrogates, lesbians and women who have frozen their eggs in order to either pursue a career and return to child bearing in their 40s or because they saved their genetic material while receiving radio or chemotherapy. More reasons these days.

It doesn't actually matter what the question is if you are talking omission, which you are- if you were given an opportunity to inform someone of a fact and you specifically chose not to, it is active omission. Or misrepresentation.
Lying.
Immoral yes.

YIn doing so you aid your cause regardless of the consequence to another's.

Immoral yes.
But why even bother polling an internet forum?
Does one actually base morality on such results or is this only an exercise?

...and I mean, the answer to your question is right there.
You have no intentions of informing any of the appropriate parties, so you are intentionally withholding information- which you yourself characterize as a "lie" and a "trick". Both of these things indicate malicious intent [in context].

I'm not sure why the confusion over morality here.

From what he has said he was either looking to be congratulated for his "conquest", wanted to brag about it or was trolling. He wasn't interested in opinions that did not support his actions.

Waaaaaaaaiiiit a second. So are you saying that *any* personal preference on my behalf is discriminatory? That is what you are saying. So basically I should accept any sperm regardless of whether the guy is smart/dumb, tall/short, black/white, AS.NT etc... because refusing for any of those reasons is discriminatory?

I think that would be a fair statement. If society is going to do this I think it should be a gamble. Or alternatively as a tool of the government to manipulate the development of the species, hopefully for the better.

If people have a problem with IVF they should protest it's existence using legal avenues.

As for it being a gamble.. how would it be fair if a Chinese baby were born to a white couple if they have no idea what the culture is like? They may grow up feeling isolated and like they do not belong.

I think any baby would be happy to be in a loving safe home regardless of the culture. Babies bond to those who care for them. They can study their heritage later if they're even interested. And frankly I'm surprised to hear the sentiment of your last sentence. I don't know why you would think the child would feel that way.

They may if the parents have asked for a child of their own race and then suddenly get one of a different race. The same thing has happened with adoption. Cultural Identity is very important.

One such example is a baby getting rejected for having down syndrome. Now this story is highly complex and disturbing. The baby was rejected for having a disability yet the biological father who donated the sperm was a convicted child molester. There are suspicions as to why he wanted the "normal" girl in the first place and going by the interview I saw with the father it was not for the good of the daughter. It's all well and good to say "Well if the parents reject a baby that is their own fault for going through IVF". I agree to a point but I think it is best to minimize the risk of the child being rejected. Political idealism won't help those babies with disabilities who get rejected.


Baby Gammy story takes startling turn as extreme options revealed

I think the point the previous poster made was that having a child with a different culture (or race) is hardly going to be as big an impact on a family as having a child with autism or down's syndrome.

I'm guessing your dragging poor little Gammy into this discussion indicate you have reservations about interracial adoption or surrogacy?

It depends on the level of disability. Some with DS are fairly functional as are ASD.. some are not which is what the OP is risking all for the sake of his ego.



I "dragged" him into the discussion as he is an example where biological parents have rejected a child because he had a disability rather than his race and alot of lying was involved. I used race as an example for comparison where someone has wanted one kind of child and got another. I think Gammy is very fortunate to have the mother he has. They look beautiful together, she clearly wants him and loves him so I do not think he's "poor Gammy". He could have a very bright future.

With race.. it really depends on the parents and how they raise them. I've known adoptees who had very little exposure to their culture and grew up with that heavily impacting their identity and they ended up pissed off not knowing where they came from. The whole idea of surrogacy is not something I'm against but I have many reservations about picking babies from a catalogue. They are people not products or political placards.