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MyWorld
Deinonychus
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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 3:51 am    Post subject: Unemployment rate among ASD adults Reply with quote

Its been said that unemployment rate for those with ASD's is around 80-90%. I think that's a little high. I understand as those with autism who cannot get a job, but what about those with Aspergers and PDD-NOS who are able to get a job? Sorry if I sound so ignorant, but I was wondering why only 10-20% of ASD adults are employed?
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Chronos
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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 4:15 am    Post subject: Re: Unemployment rate among ASD adults Reply with quote

MyWorld wrote:
Its been said that unemployment rate for those with ASD's is around 80-90%. I think that's a little high. I understand as those with autism who cannot get a job, but what about those with Aspergers and PDD-NOS who are able to get a job? Sorry if I sound so ignorant, but I was wondering why only 10-20% of ASD adults are employed?


Because in reality, most NT's are disturbed by those who are different than they are, or can't perform to their standards or do things their way. They generally don't understand people on the spectrum and tend to assume any short comings are global rather than local and can't be bothered to extend much in the way of patience.

It's actually those a little down the spectrum from HFA/AS who are the most likely to get and hold a job, but these are likely to be menial jobs through organizations that work with disabled adults, and they usually perform the job in groups under direct supervision and those employing them generally extend their patience because the nature of their being is usually severe enough such that in the mind of others they are seen to have a disability worthy of patience and compassion.

Those with HFA/AS usually just come across as odd in a way which makes people uneasy rather than compassionate or understanding.

There is a man around here who polishes metallic architectural features on some historic monuments for a living. I can tell he is clearly on the spectrum. He has an odd cadence to his speech but he's actually quite intelligent and used to be in the electronic repair industry until the shop he worked at closed down.

Unfortunately he's homeless and I speculate the reason for this is, like many on the spectrum, he just can't effectively communicate to people his actual abilities and people are immediately put off by his speech patterns.
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AllieKat
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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 5:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The vast, vast majority of people over 25 with AS are undiagnosed because it was literally unheard of in the U.S. until it was officially recognized in 1994 and not commonly diagnosed until around 2000ish.

Therefore, I think that stats are skewed towards those adults who have been diagnosed and I think those who have sought diagnosis are more likely to have done so because of problems they've been having in coping with general adult life including employment. Many adults with milder forms of AS may suspect they have it after reading about it but choose not to seek a diagnosis because they have learned to cope with the NT world, holding down a job, etc.

Therefore, I tend to agree that 80 percent seems a bit high. I have no idea what the true numbers are but for my insights on this, you can view my webpage at http://www.myaspergerslifestory.com/my_insights_on_aspergers.html

My guess is if you count the milder cases that are undiagnosed it could range anywhere from 25 percent up to maybe 70 percent who are chronically underemployed but then again this is just a wild educated guess.

Just my two cents,
Allie Kat


Last edited by AllieKat on Sun May 01, 2011 5:09 am; edited 1 time in total
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Roman
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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 5:02 am    Post subject: Re: Unemployment rate among ASD adults Reply with quote

Chronos wrote:

Because in reality, most NT's are disturbed by those who are different than they are, or can't perform to their standards or do things their way. They generally don't understand people on the spectrum and tend to assume any short comings are global rather than local and can't be bothered to extend much in the way of patience.


That is exactly it in my situation. Especially regarding people assuming my short comming is global rather than local.

For example, if someone says me something and I ask a question in a way that comes off "too intense" they assume that I will never listen no matter what they say so I am immovable. Or if they ask me what kinds of interests in physics I have (physics is my specialty) and I go on and on about my ideas, they assume my ideas is all I care about and I am not going to be willing to work on anything else.

As you see from the above two examples, it is not a "failure to perform" but rather a "SIGN that I am GOING to fail to perform". NT-s tend to look at SIGNS. But as an aspie I don't get why they trust these signs so much -- it is almost as silly as subjecting people to mandatory psychoanalysis before giving job. But then again, maybe NT-s are aware that they are EXPECTED to show certain signs so they do. But as an aspie I don't pay attention to signs, I just go from point A to point B. And then in my way to point B someone stops me and says "no you can't go any more because I can just see you are not going to make it".

A lot of it is also a self fulfilling prophecy. Once NT-s think it is useless to collaborate with me, they stop trying. Therefore, I have no choice but to work on my own projects without collaborations. Then my "history" of working on my own projects is used as a confirmation that I "can't" collaborate.
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LiendaBalla
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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tell an averege NT about any kind of "mental disorder", blindness, or hearing problems, and they will either use you and deny your skill and effort, or keep you out all together. That's how it works in my world. Sad
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Aspiewordsmith
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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 10:38 am    Post subject: Unenployment rate in ASD adults Reply with quote

With people on the spectrum looking for a job can be hard. He or she has to think what he or she can do what his or her strengths are in terms of being able to use his or her Asperger syndrome or other condition on the autism spectrum. If he or she has found something that he or she can do by the usual means going into the Jobcentre, looking in the jobs section of the local newspaper, looking on the internet etc. Then phones up or emails a firm and sends him or her an application form which is filled in and sent back. Most of the forms head for the potential employer's bin. If the person has succeded by this stage he or she will be invited for an interview. That is with the company's personnel officer. They are expecting the person to make the right eye contact check body language etc. Here an aspie would be told we'll let you know and a confirmation of a failed application awaits them about 3 days later. This happened alot to me from 1985-1987. Employers would have preferred to hire a trained monkey than a person on the autistic spectrum. I don't see things changing much. Arrow
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Downtown
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PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2011 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are some links and stats about people with Asperger's and jobs.

From Born on a Blue Day by Daniel Tammet

"research in 2001 by the u.k.'s national autistic society indicated that only 12% of those with high-functionoing autism or asperger's syndrome had full-time jobs. in contrast, 49% of people with other disabilities, and 81% of people who are not disabled were in employment"



http://www.help4aspergers.com/pb/wp_44644162/wp_44644162.html

Approximately one in 100 people are on the autism spectrum. Most have a milder form known as Asperger Syndrome (AS). Although people with AS are usually highly intelligent and gifted it is thought that over 85% are without full-time employment. That is an outrageously high percentage. This book is a resource to help employers accommodate this growing population, and for this growing population to find and keep gainful employment. We will find out what our strengths are and how to use them. We will learn how to manage social and environmental difficulties. “Working” looks into all aspects of employment– because going to work isn’t just about work. It’s about what you wear, what you eat, what your environment looks like, what it feels like, how your boss behaves, how your coworkers treat you. There’s so much more to a job than what the tasks are.
From a lack of fulfillment, sensory issues, ostracizing and bullying by coworkers and bosses, Rudy Simone presents very difficult challenges in a very positive light that will leave everyone enriched, enlightened and ready to work…together.



http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/10/29/aspergers-at-work-why-im-difficult-in-meetings/

Eighty percent of adults with Asperger Syndrome do not have full-time work. This not because they can’t do the work. It’s that they can’t manage to be socially acceptable while they get the work done. ‘
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FreeSpirit2000
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 10, 2013 6:06 am    Post subject: n/a Reply with quote

What needs to happen is Regional Centers should advocate for ways to find alternative routes for people with ASD to get jobs/work if you ask me. They can suggest things like Web Design, Blogging, Taking Online Surveys, and the "Work At Home" oriented things. Those could be one thing. Another thing is becoming a music producer and working at a music recording studio. That could be another thing. Or working as a transportation professional. Or, working for Fed-Ex, or the US Postal Service. Another cool idea would be writing books and stories could be another idea. Or some stress-free business ideas like maintaining Swimming Pools, landscaping work, skilled trades or opening a Vending Machine operation route. Find ideas which will be realistic and achievable for people with ASD related issues.

Avoid these kinds of jobs: Working in crowded retail stores, working in a crowded auto body shop, anything corporate related (working at a big law firm or CPA firm). Working as an academic can be stressful too as well.

For me, I am interested in studying to become a Recording Technician. Maybe after completing a degree in that, I would love to get a job at a recording studio, or produce my own music. Because when I was young, I used to play a couple of musical instruments and I was really good at playing them, actually. So I would like to bring back some of my old talents back, but do some new things with it, and also do them for a living, as well.
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ianorlin
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 10, 2013 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I actually think this is bad for society as a whole. I tend to end up thinking about David Ricardo's idea of comparative advantage with differences and work needing to get done have people specailise in what they give up the least total production and the economy becomes more efficient. Like having a brain that works in a different way wouldn't change how people produce different goods.
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Simmian7
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i was pretty close to becoming a part of that statistic. but after i came back from being on my birthday vacation, i got good news and a new work area! i have been feeling soooooo much better now.
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GiantHockeyFan
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I told my GP today that every so called expert seems to think that being employed means you can't have Aspergers and I told him how I know more about Autism that any psychiatrist or psychologist I have ever met. He chuckled and said "yes, you probably do." I AM employed successfully full time but let's not kid ourselves. Like a lot of undiagnosed Aspies I am vastly underemployed and spent years after university working minimum wage jobs where everyone told me I was wasting my talents. I even see a suspected Aspie in his 40s all the time and he works at the movie theatre as a concession stand worker! All the suspected Aspies I see are ALL either underemployed or are still in school in their 30s and all of them are polite, friendly and look like they are highly intelligent too. What the f*** else do employers want?

I know a former co-workers husband who I am 100% sure has severe Aspergers and he was unemployed for years despite being having genius level intelligence. He finally landed a job..... at McDonalds where he worked for a couple years before getting a proper Science job. Most of the "help" provided by charities, etc are gearing towards drug addicts, criminals or other so called undesirables but nobody thinks about AS/HFA adults. I'm sure they probably just think we are all lazy and unmotivated like one career counselor told me I came across as Evil or Very Mad Like one counsellor told me "with your intelligence and degree there are oodles of jobs for you." When I asked where do I look she went blank.
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homers2012
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GiantHockeyFan wrote:
Well, I told my GP today that every so called expert seems to think that being employed means you can't have Aspergers and I told him how I know more about Autism that any psychiatrist or psychologist I have ever met. He chuckled and said "yes, you probably do." I AM employed successfully full time but let's not kid ourselves. Like a lot of undiagnosed Aspies I am vastly underemployed and spent years after university working minimum wage jobs where everyone told me I was wasting my talents. I even see a suspected Aspie in his 40s all the time and he works at the movie theatre as a concession stand worker! All the suspected Aspies I see are ALL either underemployed or are still in school in their 30s and all of them are polite, friendly and look like they are highly intelligent too. What the f*** else do employers want?



They want super bubbly extroverted NTs that they can go party with (the soirées not the clubbing although some would want the latter as well). Intelligence? Not important. Although it doesn't deal with AS, read Susan Cain's "Quiet" which deals with introversion. She talks a lot about the "Extroverted Ideal." Employers say they want diversity but their definition of diversity is "Be just like me."
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GiantHockeyFan
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reminds me back when i listened to talk radio they were talking about immigration. Nearly every caller said the exact same thing. To paraphrase what every single caller said:

I welcome immigrants with open arms as long as they think and act like me.

Another sign of why I am a semi-hermit. Why dont employers just be honest. No blacks, teenagers, seniors or aspies need apply. It would save everyone oh so much time.
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ladyships
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

homers2012 wrote:
They want super bubbly extroverted NTs that they can go party with (the soirées not the clubbing although some would want the latter as well). Intelligence? Not important. Although it doesn't deal with AS, read Susan Cain's "Quiet" which deals with introversion. She talks a lot about the "Extroverted Ideal." Employers say they want diversity but their definition of diversity is "Be just like me."


Seconding the Susan Cain book recommendation!

Here's a TED talk she did on the subject: http://www.ted.com/talks/susan_cain_the_power_of_introverts.html
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Daydreamer86
Deinonychus
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the main reason why a lot of people on the autistic spectrum struggle to find employment is because of the interview process. Interviewers often look for people with confident body language, good eye contact and good verbal communication skills-most people with AS, especially when stressed or anxious, as they are in that situation, are incapable of living up to that standard because of our neurological wiring. Also a lot of job adverts in the newspapers etc have the phrase "Excellent communication skills needed" even when they are not essential for the job (I do understand that jobs related to customer services do need such skills). It makes me upset that so many people who would be brilliant in the workforce are being prevented from entering the workforce due to the above. I know that, certainly in the UK, a lot of organisations have Positive About Disabled People status which means that, if you have a disability (including Aspergers), you are guaranteed an interview but sadly it's difficult to get through to employers that we can be fantastic workers even if we don't come across that well in the interview stage.

I am lucky as I am one of the 20% in employment. I genuinely believe that if, I worked in another environment rather than a special needs school, I would not be as accepted as I am. At my workplace, people are used to autism so they just see me as someone who is quirky and eccentric but has a lot to offer as well. That said, it hasn't always been smooth. When I first started, my dyspraxia meant that I was slow at the practical side of the job and my first manager even tried to get rid of me, telling me that I shouldn't have applied for the job with the problems I have! I showed him though! I have been there for 4 and a half years now and love it. My current manager is very autism friendly which really helps. I think, once someone with AS finds their niche in employment, they tend to stay there for many years in my experience (as long as they don't experience workplace bullying) as we tend to be very loyal members of staff.
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