Looks like Glenn Beck is right on Inflation

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Orwell
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03 Apr 2011, 1:39 am

Inuyasha wrote:
You sure don't act like it, in fact you've kinda demonstrated that you don't know all that much about economics. I may not be an economics expert, but I've pretty much been flying rings around you on this subject.

:lol:

Yeah, sure. :roll:

Quote:
Are you going to argue that monatizing the debt is a good thing?

Are you going to argue that someone with only a very tenuous grasp on the English language really is likely to know anything about economics?

Anyways, some amount of inflation would be good for the US export market, and given our current balance of trade our export market could use some help. We are very very far away from anything even remotely like hyperinflation.

Quote:
If things remain status quo, it is not a question of if, it is a question of when.

No, if things remain status quo it is not a question of either if or when. It simply will not happen if everything remains status quo.

Quote:
Then what do you get your news from Moveon.org, mediamatters?

Wrong again.

Quote:
Cause you typically recite the far left talking points.

Inuyasha, you don't even have any idea what the far left looks like or what their talking points are. I assure you, they hate me just as much as you do.

Quote:
As I said before, I don't make bets,

You don't have to put money on it, if that's what has you worried. Just agree that if the prediction does not come true, Beck was wrong.

Quote:
Now are you going to admit that the facts presented based on historical precident is a cause for concern

You don't understand how those historical precedents relate (or don't relate) to the modern situation in America, and neither does Beck. We are not the Weimar Republic.

Quote:
or are you going to continue in the dishonest practice of trying to get me to make sweeping predictions so if I get even a minor detail wrong you will say I have no credibility.

"Sweeping prediction?" I haven't asked for that. "Will the price of bread this December be greater than or less than $10?" is not asking for a sweeping prediction. Your refusal to provide any testable predictions ahead of time (but delight in reveling in "correct" predictions afterward) is the trademark of the con artist and scammer.

Quote:
You have tried this tactic on me before Orwell. It didn't work before, in fact you got called out about it. It will not work on me now.

When? I don't recall.


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Cyanide
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03 Apr 2011, 5:23 am

skafather84 wrote:
number5 wrote:
Feel free to buy one of Beck's insanely overpriced food insurance kits if you like, but just know you're getting ripped off.


That and gold. That's all directly tied to Beck's rhetoric. Same as Alex Jones. Both of them hock end-of-civilization crap that'll bankrupt you before the evil "bankers/globalists/jews" do.

The ironic thing is that investing in silver has a much higher rate of return! However, Beck, Jones et al. are always touting gold.... I wonder why....



JakobVirgil
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03 Apr 2011, 7:17 am

Orwell wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
You sure don't act like it, in fact you've kinda demonstrated that you don't know all that much about economics. I may not be an economics expert, but I've pretty much been flying rings around you on this subject.

:lol:

Yeah, sure. :roll:

Quote:
Are you going to argue that monatizing the debt is a good thing?

Are you going to argue that someone with only a very tenuous grasp on the English language really is likely to know anything about economics?

Anyways, some amount of inflation would be good for the US export market, and given our current balance of trade our export market could use some help. We are very very far away from anything even remotely like hyperinflation.

Quote:
If things remain status quo, it is not a question of if, it is a question of when.

No, if things remain status quo it is not a question of either if or when. It simply will not happen if everything remains status quo.

Quote:
Then what do you get your news from Moveon.org, mediamatters?

Wrong again.

Quote:
Cause you typically recite the far left talking points.

Inuyasha, you don't even have any idea what the far left looks like or what their talking points are. I assure you, they hate me just as much as you do.

Quote:
As I said before, I don't make bets,

You don't have to put money on it, if that's what has you worried. Just agree that if the prediction does not come true, Beck was wrong.

Quote:
Now are you going to admit that the facts presented based on historical precident is a cause for concern

You don't understand how those historical precedents relate (or don't relate) to the modern situation in America, and neither does Beck. We are not the Weimar Republic.

Quote:
or are you going to continue in the dishonest practice of trying to get me to make sweeping predictions so if I get even a minor detail wrong you will say I have no credibility.

"Sweeping prediction?" I haven't asked for that. "Will the price of bread this December be greater than or less than $10?" is not asking for a sweeping prediction. Your refusal to provide any testable predictions ahead of time (but delight in reveling in "correct" predictions afterward) is the trademark of the con artist and scammer.

Quote:
You have tried this tactic on me before Orwell. It didn't work before, in fact you got called out about it. It will not work on me now.

When? I don't recall.


I will cover Inayushas bet.
are subscriptions to the economist a good wager?
you when I get you one.
Ina wins you get him one?
I hate to see play go to waste.


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pandabear
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03 Apr 2011, 9:56 am

JakobVirgil wrote:
I will cover Inayushas bet.
are subscriptions to the economist a good wager?
you when I get you one.
Ina wins you get him one?
I hate to see play go to waste.


I think that we would all stand to benefit if someone would buy a subscription to The Economist for Inuyasha. That way, we would actually have some discussions that had at least some substance.

And, before Inuyasha starts jumping up and down about how "liberal" The Economist is, I believe that this publication generally supported Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher.



xenon13
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03 Apr 2011, 11:19 am

Beck speaks of inflation driven by monetary policy when the inflation described here has nothing to do with monetary policy, other than perhaps one factor - that the loose money to the super-rich (but not for everyone else) helps feed commodity bubbles, in particular food price bubbles, to create the volatility that these "achievers" use to get their God-given rewards. It certainly is not one of those "too much money chasing too few goods" money-printing causing hyperinflation scenarios that Beck likes to talk about.



Inuyasha
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03 Apr 2011, 11:38 am

Cyanide wrote:
skafather84 wrote:
number5 wrote:
Feel free to buy one of Beck's insanely overpriced food insurance kits if you like, but just know you're getting ripped off.


That and gold. That's all directly tied to Beck's rhetoric. Same as Alex Jones. Both of them hock end-of-civilization crap that'll bankrupt you before the evil "bankers/globalists/jews" do.

The ironic thing is that investing in silver has a much higher rate of return! However, Beck, Jones et al. are always touting gold.... I wonder why....


Offhand it could be cause Gold doesn't Oxidize like silver, furthermore he has mentioned on multiple occasions of buying Silver too.

Pure gold has a bright yellow color and luster traditionally considered attractive, which it maintains without oxidizing in air or water. Chemically, gold is a transition metal and a group 11 element. With exception of the noble gases, gold is the least reactive chemical element known.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold

For the record Beck has said not to put all of one's eggs in one basket, he has said have some gold in your portfolio along with other precious metals but not rely on simply precious metals.

Orwell wrote:
Are you going to argue that someone with only a very tenuous grasp on the English language really is likely to know anything about economics?


Well that seems to be what you are arguing, because I have no problems with the English Language, I'm an avid reader and have the reputation of being a walking encyclopedia.

Orwell wrote:
Anyways, some amount of inflation would be good for the US export market, and given our current balance of trade our export market could use some help. We are very very far away from anything even remotely like hyperinflation.


And if you believe that I've got some land to sell you on Saturn...

We are way beyond a little inflation here, we are talking about the Fed monatizing the debt. This happened in Germany after World War I and they suffered total economic collapse which paved the way for Hitler's rise to power.

I'm just finding it hysterical that Glenn Beck (whom has a high school education) has demonstrated he knows more than you and your college education (speaks real well about the University you attended).

Orwell wrote:
No, if things remain status quo it is not a question of either if or when. It simply will not happen if everything remains status quo.


You've gotta be kidding me, you mean to tell me you don't know what status quo means?!?!? While status quo can mean things staying the same as in nothing happening, I'm referring to status quo in regards to the behavior of Government and the Fed, thus it does not mean every goes on with nothing bad happening. The status quo in this case is the Fed monatizing the debt and printing money at a rate that makes it look like they want their printing presses to melt down.

Orwell wrote:
You don't have to put money on it, if that's what has you worried. Just agree that if the prediction does not come true, Beck was wrong.


If things continue as they are currently, based on Historical Precident (and you claim to study history so you should know this) Beck is correct. He isn't blindly pulling a prediction out of his behind like you are.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." -- George Santayana
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/George_Santayana

Orwell wrote:
You don't understand how those historical precedents relate (or don't relate) to the modern situation in America, and neither does Beck. We are not the Weimar Republic.


Sure whatever, keep telling yourself that and keep behaving like an ostrich. It didn't just happen in the Weimar Republic, it happened in other countries as well throughout history. To say it can't happen here is either the height of arrogance or the height of stupidity or both.

Orwell wrote:
Inuyasha, you don't even have any idea what the far left looks like or what their talking points are. I assure you, they hate me just as much as you do.


That still doesn't mean you aren't on the far left, you just may have one thing that you don't buy into and thus they hate you for it.

Orwell wrote:
"Sweeping prediction?" I haven't asked for that. "Will the price of bread this December be greater than or less than $10?" is not asking for a sweeping prediction. Your refusal to provide any testable predictions ahead of time (but delight in reveling in "correct" predictions afterward) is the trademark of the con artist and scammer.


Orwell, there are a lot of factors in play. Glenn Beck's "sweeping statement" which you deliberately took out of context is based on historical precident, there are numerous things that can stop this from happening, however if current trends continue Glenn Beck's prediction of what may happen is going to happen. The prices he was giving was an example to show how serious the situation is. Is this cause I can recognize figures of speech, analogies, etc. better than you can that I'm seeing this and you aren't?



Orwell
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03 Apr 2011, 12:06 pm

Inuyasha wrote:
have the reputation of being a walking encyclopedia.

Not around these parts. Other Aspies aren't as likely to be impressed with little memory parlor tricks.

Quote:
Orwell wrote:
Anyways, some amount of inflation would be good for the US export market, and given our current balance of trade our export market could use some help. We are very very far away from anything even remotely like hyperinflation.


And if you believe that I've got some land to sell you on Saturn...

Really? This is intro econ here. A stronger dollar means American-made goods cost more for foreigners to buy in terms of their own currency, so goods from elsewhere (eg China) will be relatively cheaper. A weaker dollar makes American goods cheaper by comparison, helping our export market.

Quote:
Orwell wrote:
You don't have to put money on it, if that's what has you worried. Just agree that if the prediction does not come true, Beck was wrong.


If things continue as they are currently, based on Historical Precident (and you claim to study history so you should know this) Beck is correct. He isn't blindly pulling a prediction out of his behind like you are.

Just give a yes or a no. Beck made a prediction, correct? If this prediction does not come true, it means Beck was wrong. Merely agree to that obvious and basic fact, and then at the end of this year we will see who was right.

Quote:
Sure whatever, keep telling yourself that and keep behaving like an ostrich. It didn't just happen in the Weimar Republic, it happened in other countries as well throughout history. To say it can't happen here is either the height of arrogance or the height of stupidity or both.

What, Hungary and Zimbabwe? We are not either of those countries either. The current situation in the US is absolutely nothing like the situations in nations before they suffered hyperinflation. There is no rational basis for believe it is remotely likely to happen here in the foreseeable future.

Quote:
That still doesn't mean you aren't on the far left, you just may have one thing that you don't buy into and thus they hate you for it.

I'm actually right of center by the standards of any developed country other than the US. I'm certainly not "far left" even by American standards.

Quote:
Is this cause I can recognize figures of speech, analogies, etc. better than you can that I'm seeing this and you aren't?

Inuyasha, enough of your condescending "more-NT than thou" BS. I'm decent at recognizing idiomatic expressions. Beck was not using a figure of speech; he was crying wolf, just as you have been. He is full of s**t, just as you are.


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Orwell
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03 Apr 2011, 12:10 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:
I will cover Inayushas bet.
are subscriptions to the economist a good wager?
you when I get you one.
Ina wins you get him one?
I hate to see play go to waste.

I would be happy to simply wager an admission that Beck was either right or wrong. This nonsense of pretending and gloating afterwards that you made correct predictions the 1/1000 times that you were accidentally right, while steadfastly refusing to commit to any predictions ahead of time, is the height of dishonesty. So here is my hard prediction, on which I cannot go back and which can be objectively measured: when I go to the grocery store this December to buy a loaf of bread, it will cost less than $5. Beck believes differently. In a few months, we shall see who was right and who was wrong.


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Inuyasha
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03 Apr 2011, 12:19 pm

Orwell wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
have the reputation of being a walking encyclopedia.

Not around these parts. Other Aspies aren't as likely to be impressed with little memory parlor tricks.


Point.

Orwell wrote:
Quote:
Orwell wrote:
Anyways, some amount of inflation would be good for the US export market, and given our current balance of trade our export market could use some help. We are very very far away from anything even remotely like hyperinflation.


And if you believe that I've got some land to sell you on Saturn...

Really? This is intro econ here. A stronger dollar means American-made goods cost more for foreigners to buy in terms of their own currency, so goods from elsewhere (eg China) will be relatively cheaper. A weaker dollar makes American goods cheaper by comparison, helping our export market.


Last I checked, China wasn't monatizing their own debt and China is a net lender not a net borrower. You are making false equivalencies.

Orwell wrote:
Quote:
Orwell wrote:
You don't have to put money on it, if that's what has you worried. Just agree that if the prediction does not come true, Beck was wrong.


If things continue as they are currently, based on Historical Precident (and you claim to study history so you should know this) Beck is correct. He isn't blindly pulling a prediction out of his behind like you are.

Just give a yes or a no. Beck made a prediction, correct? If this prediction does not come true, it means Beck was wrong. Merely agree to that obvious and basic fact, and then at the end of this year we will see who was right.


I'm concerned about the general jest of what Beck said has a pretty good chance of being accurate, not nitpicking in order to falsely claim someone isn't credible like what you are doing as usual.

Orwell wrote:
Quote:
Sure whatever, keep telling yourself that and keep behaving like an ostrich. It didn't just happen in the Weimar Republic, it happened in other countries as well throughout history. To say it can't happen here is either the height of arrogance or the height of stupidity or both.

What, Hungary and Zimbabwe? We are not either of those countries either. The current situation in the US is absolutely nothing like the situations in nations before they suffered hyperinflation. There is no rational basis for believe it is remotely likely to happen here in the foreseeable future.


Russia for starters, also the Roman Empire suffered from rapid inflation towards the end.

Orwell wrote:
Quote:
That still doesn't mean you aren't on the far left, you just may have one thing that you don't buy into and thus they hate you for it.

I'm actually right of center by the standards of any developed country other than the US. I'm certainly not "far left" even by American standards.


Sure whatever. :roll:

Orwell wrote:
Quote:
Is this cause I can recognize figures of speech, analogies, etc. better than you can that I'm seeing this and you aren't?

Inuyasha, enough of your condescending "more-NT than thou" BS. I'm decent at recognizing idiomatic expressions. Beck was not using a figure of speech; he was crying wolf, just as you have been. He is full of sh**, just as you are.


I am not saying I'm more NT than you are, I'm saying I can pick up on things better than you can because I have had experience you do not have. Also if you will recall Beck is also potentially on the Spectrum and at the very least has ADHD.



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03 Apr 2011, 12:26 pm

Inuyasha wrote:
Orwell wrote:
Quote:
Orwell wrote:
Anyways, some amount of inflation would be good for the US export market, and given our current balance of trade our export market could use some help. We are very very far away from anything even remotely like hyperinflation.


And if you believe that I've got some land to sell you on Saturn...

Really? This is intro econ here. A stronger dollar means American-made goods cost more for foreigners to buy in terms of their own currency, so goods from elsewhere (eg China) will be relatively cheaper. A weaker dollar makes American goods cheaper by comparison, helping our export market.


Last I checked, China wasn't monatizing their own debt and China is a net lender not a net borrower. You are making false equivalencies.

China has been artificially keeping the value of the yuan low for years and years now. They know that it benefits their balance of trade to keep the yuan low and the dollar high. But when I mentioned China, it was just an example (hence the "eg") so no equivalency, false or otherwise. The claim that inflation benefits exporters is a basic fact from into econ.

Quote:
not nitpicking

Nitpicking? This is not nitpicking, you little turd. Beck is predicting catastrophic levels of inflation. I propose to check back at the end of the year to see if he was right or not. You literally refuse to commit to anything that would allow even a hypothetical chance that Beck might be proven wrong on anything. You are suffering from a severe case of True Believer Syndrome and insist on your ridiculous unfalsifiable faith in Beck. It's like you're in a cult.


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Telekon
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03 Apr 2011, 12:34 pm

Orwell wrote:
[What, Hungary and Zimbabwe? We are not either of those countries either. The current situation in the US is absolutely nothing like the situations in nations before they suffered hyperinflation. There is no rational basis for believe it is remotely likely to happen here in the foreseeable future.


Hungary and Zimbabwe printed physical currency, while the Fed has added electronic credits to its balance sheet which could easily be eliminated. If inflation picks up, it will be caused by open market activities.



Inuyasha
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03 Apr 2011, 12:36 pm

Orwell wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
Orwell wrote:
Quote:
Orwell wrote:
Anyways, some amount of inflation would be good for the US export market, and given our current balance of trade our export market could use some help. We are very very far away from anything even remotely like hyperinflation.


And if you believe that I've got some land to sell you on Saturn...

Really? This is intro econ here. A stronger dollar means American-made goods cost more for foreigners to buy in terms of their own currency, so goods from elsewhere (eg China) will be relatively cheaper. A weaker dollar makes American goods cheaper by comparison, helping our export market.


Last I checked, China wasn't monatizing their own debt and China is a net lender not a net borrower. You are making false equivalencies.

China has been artificially keeping the value of the yuan low for years and years now. They know that it benefits their balance of trade to keep the yuan low and the dollar high. But when I mentioned China, it was just an example (hence the "eg") so no equivalency, false or otherwise. The claim that inflation benefits exporters is a basic fact from into econ.


China is not monatizing their debt, the Federal Reserve is monatizing our debt. That is the difference.

Orwell wrote:
Quote:
not nitpicking

Nitpicking? This is not nitpicking, you little turd. Beck is predicting catastrophic levels of inflation. I propose to check back at the end of the year to see if he was right or not. You literally refuse to commit to anything that would allow even a hypothetical chance that Beck might be proven wrong on anything. You are suffering from a severe case of True Believer Syndrome and insist on your ridiculous unfalsifiable faith in Beck. It's like you're in a cult.


Beck's statements were based on facts, and historical precidents.

Germany between WW I and WW II, Russia following collapse of Soviet Union, Roman Empire, Hungary, Zimbabwe, and others...

We aren't just talking the debt itself, we're also talking interest payments, among other things.



pandabear
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03 Apr 2011, 12:38 pm

Yoo-hoo. Here is a series of articles on the US economy. You may read them even without a subscription to The Economist.

http://www.economist.com/topics/us-economy

If you look at the April 1 article

Quote:
TURN off the alarms. After several weeks when the data pointed to a recovery still struggling to achieve escape velocity, the March employment report provided reassuring evidence that, at a minimum, it is still gaining altitude.

.....

There may be a case for the Fed to back away from its ultra-easy monetary stance sometime this year; however, it will take many more months of good economic news like today’s. The more dovish, and influential, William Dudley, president of the New York Fed, said as much today. “This is welcome and not a reason to reverse course,” he said. The economy, he noted, is performing much as the Fed expected. “We must not be overly optimistic about the growth outlook.” This recovery’s serial disappointments suggest he’s right.



pandabear
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03 Apr 2011, 12:44 pm

And here is a March 30 article on inflation

Quote:
Why use core inflation?
Mar 30th 2011, 15:30 by R.A. | WASHINGTON

THERE is a bit of split among the central banks of the rich world over whether it is better to focus policy choices on headline inflation or "core", that is, broad inflation stripped of volatile components like energy and food prices. It seems intuitively right to use headline inflation; after all, people spend money on petrol and bread just as they do on computers and tax preparation services. The use of the core measure may seem opportunistic to laypeople—like playing games with the numbers to get the figures that justify preferred policy choices.

But that's not the reason central banks like the Federal Reserve tend to focus on core inflation. Larry Meyer comments:

Why do we, as forecasters, and the FOMC in its own forecasts, focus on core inflation? The question should not be whether I buy groceries and gas, but whether headline or core inflation is a better measure of where headline inflation is likely to settle once overall prices have adjusted to the higher prices of energy and food. As forecasters, we want to know not only what (headline) inflation is today, but also, and much more importantly, where headline inflation is likely to be tomorrow (the medium term). Identifying a measure of underlying inflation gives us a good head start...Our thesis, and the FOMC’s position, is that headline inflation converges to core, that is, headline inflation tomorrow will fall towards core inflation today. Whether or not this is a valid thesis is an empirical question...If you test whether higher oil prices raised core inflation over the 1970s and early 1980s (or in samples that include this period), the answer is a definitive “Yes” (higher oil prices pass through to core inflation). In this case, core inflation tomorrow will converge to headline today. However, if you test this hypothesis over the subsequent period, from the mid-1980s to today, the answer is “No” (no pass-through). In this case, headline tomorrow will converge to core today. This is the basis for our forecasts...
The Fed has built credibility over the last two decades: Long-term inflation expectations are stable, have been stable for more than a decade, and are likely to remain so. This means that spikes in food and energy prices do not get translated into expectations of higher inflation down the road and, thus, do not lead to a generalized increase in prices, today or tomorrow. So the critical question is whether inflation expectations are well anchored today—we believe that they are—and, more importantly, whether they are likely to remain so...
One interesting thing to point out is that in the 1970s real GDP growth was often very high, and likely above potential. Real output grew by more than 5% in 1972, 1973, 1976, and 1978. Labour markets were often tight in this period, especially in the early 1970s, and core consumer price inflation was quite high even before the oil price shock in 1973. Conditions now are obviously quite different, and so it's not necessarily a good idea to think that rising oil and food prices will deliver the stagflation we observed in the 1970s.

But an interesting question does arise: what if rising food and fuel prices aren't transitory? What if emerging market growth, for example, will produce a steady, structural shift in the relative prices of scarce commodities? It's pretty clear how a credible monetary policymaker should handle a temporary shock; it's much harder to know what to do in this case. It's possible that headline inflation would persistently overshoot the desired level, even as the central bank held policy tighter than it preferred while growth lagged. In a Sumnerian, nominal GDP-targeting regime in this case, you might end up taking your 5% NGDP target in the form of 1% real GDP growth and 4% inflation for some time, while the economy adjusts.

That scenario, should it emerge, will prove challenging. But it does not appear to be what most of today's inflation hawks are worried about; rather, they seem to be concerned that, as in the early 1970s, a reckless Fed is simply failing to take the necessary steps to manage garden variety inflation. This seems wrong to me, because core inflation is well in hand and because long-term inflation expectations remain quite low. And mistakenly tightening in these circumstances is likely to reduce macroeconomic stability—to knock growth off its present, near-trend (and, many would say, insufficient) rate and to send inflation expectations falling, just as they did last summer.



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03 Apr 2011, 12:48 pm

Telekon wrote:
Orwell wrote:
[What, Hungary and Zimbabwe? We are not either of those countries either. The current situation in the US is absolutely nothing like the situations in nations before they suffered hyperinflation. There is no rational basis for believe it is remotely likely to happen here in the foreseeable future.


Hungary and Zimbabwe printed physical currency, while the Fed has added electronic credits to its balance sheet which could easily be eliminated. If inflation picks up, it will be caused by open market activities.


Fed has been printing physical currency too.

@ pandabear

Yeah that sounds all well and good except for the fact the official unemployment numbers do not count the people that have dropped off the rolls due to jobless benefits running out, people having simply given up, people whom are underemployed, etc. In fact if the economist is as good as what you claim they are, I'm surprised they bought what the Federal Government is saying.
http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/caree ... /19833935/



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03 Apr 2011, 12:54 pm

Inuyasha wrote:
Fed has been printing physical currency too.


The BEP and US Mint operate under the auspices of the Department of Treasury, not the Fed. The Fed is privately owned.