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John Brown: Hero, or Villain? Previous  1, 2, 3  
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John Brown was a:
Hero!
63%
 63%  [ 7 ]
Villain!
18%
 18%  [ 2 ]
I don't know, just show the results.
18%
 18%  [ 2 ]
Total Votes : 11

Joker
Sinn Fein
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Age: 25
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Location: North Carolina The Tar Heel State :)

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

naturalplastic wrote:
Joker wrote:
Plus your talking about past things I live in the present


Youre the one who brought up the past.

Not me.


I didn't bring up the past I didn't start this thread.
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naturalplastic
Phoenix
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Joined: Aug 27, 2010
Posts: 7878
Location: mid atlantic coast usa

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

John_Browning wrote:
Joker wrote:
Paul Mooney was the one that said we should have used the slaves and the war was fought over other issues besides slavery.

He's right on both counts. There were a few Confederate units that were formed for combat rather than just labor, but neither side used them extensively.


Niether side used black troops 'extensively"?

36 thousand Black solders died for the Union cause.
Thats pretty extensive.

That happens to be 10 percent of the deaths on the union side.
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naturalplastic
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joker wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Joker wrote:
Plus your talking about past things I live in the present


Youre the one who brought up the past.

Not me.


I didn't bring up the past I didn't start this thread.


But youre the one who kept repeating the mantra of "north carolina didnt have that many slaves"!

Thats ... bringing up the past... is it not?
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Joker
Sinn Fein
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Age: 25
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Location: North Carolina The Tar Heel State :)

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

naturalplastic wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
Joker wrote:
Paul Mooney was the one that said we should have used the slaves and the war was fought over other issues besides slavery.

He's right on both counts. There were a few Confederate units that were formed for combat rather than just labor, but neither side used them extensively.


Niether side used black troops 'extensively"?

36 thousand Black solders died for the Union cause.
Thats pretty extensive.

That happens to be 10 percent of the deaths on the union side.


Of course the Union would use them if the south was smart we would have used them plus we had more then them.
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Joker
Sinn Fein
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Joined: Mar 20, 2011
Age: 25
Posts: 7593
Location: North Carolina The Tar Heel State :)

PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

naturalplastic wrote:
Joker wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Joker wrote:
Plus your talking about past things I live in the present


Youre the one who brought up the past.

Not me.


I didn't bring up the past I didn't start this thread.


But youre the one who kept repeating the mantra of "north carolina didnt have that many slaves"!

Thats ... bringing up the past... is it not?


Me bringing that up was apart of a arguement that I was having with some one not you. Plus they had the fewest slaves as a southern state that is a fact.
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Kraichgauer
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Age: 48
Posts: 20066
Location: Spokane Valley, Washington

PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ruveyn wrote:
ArrantPariah wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
Joker wrote:
Paul Mooney was the one that said we should have used the slaves and the war was fought over other issues besides slavery.

He's right on both counts. There were a few Confederate units that were formed for combat rather than just labor, but neither side used them extensively.


Ten percent of the Union army was Black.

http://www.archives.gov/education/lessons/blacks-civil-war/


The Massachussetts 54 th a black regiment distinguished itself in its attack on Battery Wagner.

Many of the black soldiers in the Union Army were escaped slaves. Payback time.

The Union black soldiers were the Confederates worst nightmare. Black men with loaded rifles.

ruveyn


And that was why Jefferson Davis and the much lauded Robert E. Lee had decided that any black man serving in the Union army would be immediately shot or bayoneted rather than be taken as prisoners of war. When Lincoln had implored the Confederacy to cease this policy - even going to the extent of promising to free Confederate prisoners of war in return - the answer was still a resounding NO.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
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ArrantPariah
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Joined: Mar 31, 2012
Posts: 8800

PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joker wrote:

Of course the Union would use them if the south was smart we would have used them plus we had more then them.


Runaway slaves?
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HisDivineMajesty
Carolingian Emperor Extraordinaire
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Joined: Feb 01, 2012
Posts: 1364
Location: Planet Earth

PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking at it from a pure perspective, a villain. He believed in something, but taking away the thing he believed in, he's no better than your average bloodthirsty maniac. He believed in abolitionism, which is why most of you have branded him a hero, but I'm sure the families of those he killed would have disagreed. If you want to judge personal actions, try looking at them in a different light. Had he gathered a crowd to lynch a slave who was a rapist, would he have been a hero? Had he shot Lincoln to let the South win the war, would he have been a hero? Taking away his motivations, those being something we all agree are relatively good, he's just as bad as Karadzic, Che Guevara or Gavrilo Princip. Essentially, all he did was murder people because of his political opinion. As a peaceful activist, I would have supported him. As a murderer, a man who left several families without their fathers and sons for something they believed in, he's a villain.
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