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marshall
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29 Jul 2016, 9:14 pm

It is assumed even very ill or disabled men can "fend for themselves" because men are supposed to be the "stronger" sex. Women are more likely to be taken care of because they appear more vulnerable. Women can get welfare or disability easier than men. It just appears society isn't fair.



LKL
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29 Jul 2016, 9:20 pm

Fnord wrote:
1. In a divorce, a judge is more likely to award custody of the children to the woman than to the man...

Custody is awarded to the parent who has shouldered the primary burden of child care, which is almost always the woman in a heterosexual couple.
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...and thereby set cause as to why the woman should also receive the full share of their jointly-owned domicile...

The children remain in the home along with their primary care giver in order to minimize disruption to them; said caregiver, if he or she wants to obtain sole ownership of the house, must pay half the value of the house to his or her former spouse.
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...and as much as half of the man's wages in child and spousal support.

The primary care-giver of the children has almost always sacrificed his or her career to some degree in order to care for the children and provide a home for the family; the primary bread-winner compensates the care-giver for this home-work in the event of a divorce. If the care-giver still has a career (as is most often the case these days), then the non-custodial parent is only required to continue supporting his or her own children.
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Suddenly, the man has no home, no family, and very little means to pay off his legal expenses and pay for a place to live.

Not being the primary custodian doesn't mean that one has no family. My dad was still my dad after my parents broke up.
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2. Men have a greater likelihood of being veterans, with the tendency to have acquired some form of PTSD or "Combat Fatigue", thus making them virtually unemployable.

1)VA
2)SS Disability
And, yes, those are diddly-squat compared to what they should be.
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Also, when a man is discharged on "Less Then Honorable" terms, employers are likely to turn him away and hire someone with an Honorable Discharge.

I'm less than sympathetic with someone who committed the equivalent of a criminal act in order to get him or herself discharged dishonorably.
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Also, there is the general tendency to perceive military veterans as brainwashed, gun-crazy murderers.

There's also a general tendency to obsequiously worship at the feet of veterans, and a hell of a lot of employment programs that are either veterans-only or give preference to veterans.
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3. There is the tendency of men to not seek treatment for their mental illnesses and substance abuse issues. Whether this is because of the traditional male attitude of "Toughing it out" or "Handling it", and the perception that asking for help makes them look weak, this leads to a downward spiral of erratic behavior that gets them fired and leaves them chronically unemployed.

Agreed. This is a problem with patriarchy that should be wiped out. Men should feel just as free to seek help and to show weakness as women, without being socially penalized for it.
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4. Women are more likely to be housed than men. This is especially true for women with children, and/or abused women. There seems to be a larger number of shelters and services for women in trouble than for men.

I agree that there should be more shelters for single women without children, for single men without children, and for men with children. It is especially egregious that even many large cities do not have shelters for male victims of domestic violence and male parents.
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This may be due to the perception that women are the victims in domestic disputes, whether or not that perception is valid in every case.

It is a fact that women are more often victims of violent, physically dangerous domestic abuse than men, though of course that statistic is only true of the population.



Chronos
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29 Jul 2016, 9:49 pm

Darmok wrote:
Chronos wrote:
The help is there for many of these men, but it's difficult to get these men to accept it.


Translation: If men are homeless, it's their own fault.


How do you force someone to take help they don't want? What have you done to help these men?



Chronos
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29 Jul 2016, 9:53 pm

marshall wrote:
It is assumed even very ill or disabled men can "fend for themselves" because men are supposed to be the "stronger" sex. Women are more likely to be taken care of because they appear more vulnerable. Women can get welfare or disability easier than men. It just appears society isn't fair.


Women do not get disability easier. I'm familiar with the process of obtaining SSI/SSDI and there is nothing in the requirements that is sex specific. The application process is the same for everyone, as is the appeals process.

Women may obtain welfare easier only by virtue of the fact that they tend to more often be single parents with primary custody. A single woman without a child not be more entitled to welfare than a single man without a child, and a man who is a single parent with primary custody would qualify just the same as the woman who is a single parent with primary custody.



The_Face_of_Boo
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30 Jul 2016, 6:45 am

Chronos wrote:
Darmok wrote:
Chronos wrote:
The help is there for many of these men, but it's difficult to get these men to accept it.


Translation: If men are homeless, it's their own fault.


How do you force someone to take help they don't want? What have you done to help these men?


A lot of homeless men beg for food in the streets, you really think that they don't ask for help?



kraftiekortie
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30 Jul 2016, 7:05 am

They don't want help that takes away their freedom.



Chronos
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30 Jul 2016, 9:23 pm

Densaugeo wrote:
Chronos wrote:
Spiderpig wrote:
Males are biologically the expendable sex.


Biologically but not socially or emotionally. The help is there for many of these men, but it's difficult to get these men to accept it.


Shelters offer very little help...

A homeless person staying in a shelter is still homeless. They still have nowhere to go during the day (most shelters require residents to leave early in the morning and not come back until night), they still have to find food, they still very limited access to ID, banks, and other services needed to participate in the economy.

Serious housing programs are far, far harder to get into. In my city, the wait time for publicly assisted housing is around 5 years. And that's for people who qualify, have no criminal background, pass drug tests, etc.. Anyone facing addiction or mental illness is expected to cure themselves before they can receive help.

So no, the help is not there, even for people who ask. Unless you have children with you (and even then only a little help).


This applies to men and women equally though.



Chronos
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30 Jul 2016, 9:27 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Chronos wrote:
Darmok wrote:
Chronos wrote:
The help is there for many of these men, but it's difficult to get these men to accept it.


Translation: If men are homeless, it's their own fault.


How do you force someone to take help they don't want? What have you done to help these men?


A lot of homeless men beg for food in the streets, you really think that they don't ask for help?


Again, maybe in Lebanon, but in the US, not so much. Food is fairly cheap and readily available at food banks and shelters, and we throw so much edible food out that many homeless individuals will scavenge dumpsters....we actually have a number of non-homeless people, with well paying jobs do this as well...or people who do not need to do it but do it for whatever reason....they are called "freegans".



We do often have panhandlers who will ask for money, but a lot of times, this money goes for alcohol or drugs, though not always. They may occasionally need a personal item they can't obtain at a shelter, or don't care to go to a shelter to get.



redrobin62
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30 Jul 2016, 9:37 pm

Yeah. Shelters are bad. I've stayed in a few but prefer the street.



marshall
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31 Jul 2016, 8:37 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
They don't want help that takes away their freedom.

And their space/privacy. I can easily see this being a huge issue. I would rather kill myself than sleep in a shelter.



Meistersinger
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31 Jul 2016, 9:23 pm

I'm one of those men that actually reached out for help. What did it get me? Eternal contempt from the family, as well as my so-called friends. With a few exceptions, I'm persona non grata wherever I go and ask for help.



Chronos
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31 Jul 2016, 10:57 pm

Meistersinger wrote:
I'm one of those men that actually reached out for help. What did it get me? Eternal contempt from the family, as well as my so-called friends. With a few exceptions, I'm persona non grata wherever I go and ask for help.


The help I am speaking of in this context is in the form of government and charity services. For example, my city just gave a bunch of tents to long time homeless residents who refuse shelters.