The autism social rule book.

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I think it’s a good idea to report suspected abuse/harm. Investigators/experts are typically better at figuring out whether wrongdoing has taken place or not. This is especially the case with suspected child abuse where you often can’t know for sure if it happened but there are signs. Similarly, if there’s a domestic dispute going on with adult neighbors and it sounds like there may be a physical altercation, I think a neighborly thing to do would be to make a call even though one wouldn’t know for sure if someone was being harmed.[/quote]

Hi Twilight Princess.
In Italy, if you report certain things, you risk getting into a mess of lawsuits.
I'll explain.
If you report, you must provide your full name; an anonymous report won't be considered.

The result is a complaint from a trusted party.
The same goes for the other scenario.

If a report of child abuse is taken into account and a presumed liability is established (again, by law, one is innocent until proven guilty), an investigative measure could also be imposed on the reporter. Even up to 2 years.

Investigations into abused children, for example, involve social workers.
Who will do everything to remove them from their families.
Who may just be guilty of being poor.
But they are excellent parents.

There was a report here.
Important. About a school.
They found abuse.
Committed by several teachers.
Women.

Despite the evidence, they are now free.

In Italian schools, the role of men in teaching has almost completely disappeared.

The evidence was documented by the police for years.

Because in court, it must be unassailable.

It was of no avail.

Only those who report are at risk, and unfortunately, a lot.

I would agree with you on both counts.

But it never happens.

Not even if, for example, I defended a girl from her boyfriend's violence.
And she recanted the things she suffered.

I would end up in trouble.

In court.

I don't know if it's any different where you live.

(I hope this isn't off-topic, if so, I apologize.)

That’s how many people think it works where I live, but it’s not how it actually is. I know from having made several reports when I was a teacher (only one adult was removed from the home due to my reporting) and from working with those families and my fellow teachers. I’ve also talked to CPS workers here before. They don’t want to take children. They want children to stay with their families whenever possible and strive to push stuff like parenting classes for that reason. There’s a lot of red tape involved with taking children. It’s also expensive, and there’s a lack of resources. I will say that not all families are always treated the same, though. There certainly are disparities and sometimes mistakes can be made - either way, but I don’t think they should keep us from looking out for kids’ safety and wellbeing.

One of the densest concentrations of fear/negativity here towards CPS is rooted in the pro-corporal punishment crowd in very conservative circles. It was big in my culture growing up even though we knew no kids who were taken away and some that should’ve been.

Suspected abuse here can be reported anonymously. Even if it couldn’t be, I’d still report because I care about the welfare of children. It’s not my job to determine if abuse took place. That’s up to investigators. The risks are just too great in my opinion not to report if one has reasonable reason(s) to suspect that abuse occurred or is still occurring. I’d feel compelled to report situations with adults, lawsuits or not, although, granted, it would depend on the situation. Kids tend to be more vulnerable than adults. If it were up to me, everyone over the age of 18 would be a mandated reporter.

Edit: I just looked this up. In Italy, you can apparently anonymously report child abuse through Telefono Azzurro. It seems similar to Childline where I live.

Hi dear Twilight Princess.

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It definitely works very well for you.

What happens here is that, if a report is made, they send social workers to the home immediately.

Let me explain: if it's a poor family, then the problems begin.

They take the child for a visit.

They give him tests and ask him questions.

They often look for an answer.

If the child doesn't provide one, then they try to have him draw.

They interpret the drawing.

In their own way.

In fact, 9 out of 10 create enormous inconvenience for the parents and the child himself.

They get a decree. Then the child goes into foster care, then maybe adoption.

That's how it works for us.

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For the rest, I totally agree with you; I'd do the same thing anyway.
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But for example: a friend of mine is separated and has a daughter.
The mother (without evidence) said he was violent.
He is the kindest and most generous person I know.

Even the neighbors testified that he was.

Divorce, custody with the mother, he sees her once a week for an hour.

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In my case: immediate condominium stalking.
Documentary evidence, video, audio, testimonies...
Since 2018 (before that, I tried for 8 years to reach a good relationship).
The fact is, I'm still in the criminal case, even though I'm right.

You understand that doing something like that here becomes hellish.

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Always another example.
In a kindergarten, the teachers abused children.

There have been complaints and investigations for many months.
With documentary evidence and wiretaps.

Do you know, Twilight Princess, how it ended? The teachers are in their own home.

Reinstated.

I have references for everything I write, I can prove it.

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Justice doesn't work here.

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I know and remember that you were the only person here to take a clear stand for G.'s children in the dedicated thread when I.started waging war on P.

It's not taking anyone's side.

But I take the children's side: and these (too many) are no longer here.
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I've removed all political references.

Hopefully, they can fix the legal situation because reporting suspected abuse is critically important. I can’t stress that enough. Most of the time, you aren’t going to know for sure if a child is being abused, especially if we’re talking about CSA. Mandated reporters might get training on what to look for - possible signs - but even they aren’t going to know for sure much of the time. That’s what investigators are for. In my country, mandated reporters are required to report even suspected abuse. According to the research, there are very good reasons for that.

Yes, I agree with you. You're absolutely right!

The problem is that those who report often experience a lot of subsequent legal problems.

Then the families.
I mean, our system doesn't work as it should.

Not even in the defensive phase of stalking, for example, immediate stalking, does one risk either having no protection at all or having a very long phase without protection.

A very long phase, many years.

It applies to many other things.


Clearly, here too, we have the obligation to report and also to intervene to stop it, because in such sensitive cases, it would be considered failure to provide assistance...
It depends on the age of the minors. Some are truly very delicate because they are small and unable to understand.

Some, if they are old enough, are made to draw.
Sometimes those drawings are misinterpreted by those who are supposed to protect them.

Dedalico as an intervention.

At the root: it doesn't work as well as it could.

And often they are entrusted to other people deemed capable.

The rest takes many years.

And often disastrous for the children and their families.

And for those who report.


Sorry, it's a very sensitive topic.

Another example: Perhaps yesterday a 15-year-old girl committed suicide following bullying at school.
The parents had repeatedly reported the incident to the teachers.

No one did or could do anything.

The result is horrendous.

I also experienced three years of stalking at school.

It could have ended the same way.

Sucs, the personal reference.

I’m certainly not blaming the parents over this horrible situation, but maybe they should’ve tried something else if they weren’t making any headway with teachers.

When my 13 year old son was bullied, I talked to teachers, then administration, and then we (temporarily) switched to a cyber charter school. That wouldn’t work for or be available to all families, but there are different options out there. Sometimes putting pressure on administration and threatening to sue can be extremely motivating. It just depends. They may feel inspired to assign aides to key rooms/hallways. Here, there are advocates that work with families, too. Administration hated it when families would show up to a meeting with one, not that it happened often.

The biggest challenge in my experience is that all this stuff is complicated and families don’t know their rights or what services are available to them.

Sorry for the delay in responding.

By the way, I wrote the word "stalking," which refers to a criminal case that hasn't been pursued for seven years.

*In Italy, it's better to leave and give up everything before asserting your rights.

People who stalk psychopaths die.

*There should also be a major global outcry about women's issues, because in many developed nations, we're terrible at this.

Those who commit certain crimes must pay with prison time.

The result is femicide (that's what we call it here: a hateful word).

In short, we do nothing to educate and, if possible, to repress these """people"""—often male.

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In the case of when I was 10 years old and until I was 13, I was bullied.

But the fundamental point was that my parents were at work and no one helped us at school.

It doesn't work even if you tell the teachers.

Which I did.

But it didn't help.

So much so that they completely didn't care.

I had half the class (males) against me.

And I lost a year of school because I hated going to exams with them next to me.

Disgust.
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Regarding the parents' faults: maybe in their day it was different.

But I never said anything to them; I thought it was enough to tell all the teachers.
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Twilight Princess: you are an excellent mother.

My mother was autistic like me.

My father wasn't.

But I spoke very little to them.

And never about this.
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*After filing a complaint (Article 612 bis of the Italian Penal Code), which I know by heart...

Things got worse, leading to the attempted extreme acts.

I won't write otherwise because I don't want to upset any sensitive people.

But I left everything there in three houses.

everything.

I'm waiting for justice that may never come.

It's called the statute of limitations.

After 7 years, the crime lapses.

Of course, I can always prove everything I write.

Documentally.

And the Judge dismisses the case; it isn't investigated without solid evidence.
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I understand everything you write, sorry for my poor written English.
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By the way, you write sublimely.
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The parents:
1) They don't know what to do and how to do it: there are specific laws, but it's the teachers' duty to ensure that these things never happen.

2) Generally, they don't follow their children.
My case.
And I tended not to say anything at home.

Personal problems were supposed to be left at home and things (at least in our country) resolved on your own.

3) You're right in everything you wrote: but on average, that's not how it happens.

I don't know the reference percentages in your country, which is perhaps much more advanced than mine in this regard.

4) In our country, the opposite often happens: if you talk about it, then you're the one causing problems.

Obviously, that's not the case.

By the way, I'm writing about things that happen all the time in schools.

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Sorry for writing about myself.

But it's not off-topic to write about social rules even in these situations.

Because these things happen very often to autistic people and others.

I thought I was stronger, but instead, these are devastating things that tear you apart inside.

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The case I wrote about is not unique to that 15-year-old girl.

I can provide documentation if you ask.

But that girl needed protection, and they left her alone.

This is disheartening.

The parents are now accusing the school of doing nothing.

The girl is no longer with us: their daughter.

I can imagine what she felt.

Because I thought the same thing back then.

But you never forget these things.

Hi sorry new here, is this still where to go to get/ give social pointers or has in evolved to something else?
Seriously asking, no cap as the kids say. thx.

Yes, the right place. Revival of old threads is a good thing here

Well, as long as it doesn’t involve reacquainting people with the historical (pre Kanner) definition of “Autisitic”, or bringing up the Chandler and Macleod on line test (sadly, no longer available, but the thread still imparts a lot of very useful information!).

Yes, it's a 'sticky' for that reason.

Welcome to the site by the way.

If they haven't left the house yet and there's a more flattering option, you can say so.

For NTs as well - don't keep on getting onto your teenager about responsibilities and what they should be able to do "because they're at that age now". Teenagers hate hearing it. Tell them they're capable, but don't keep on about their age.

My husband's daughter has a 15-year-old son who is lazy and quite heavy-handed in the kitchen, and she keeps on repeatedly yelling at him that "he's 15 now, not 12, he should get off his backside and learn how to do things". But, really, he's a 15-year-old kid acting like a typical 15-year-old kid. He may be capable, but he's still going through puberty and is still finding himself through that awkward transition from child to adult. Just expect nothing from a 15-year-old. Yes - show them things, teach them things, but don't expect too much of them yet. They'll most likely grow out of the lazy stage, so just let them be a kid for a little while more.